Topic: A diatribe against Green Energy Policies

Energy Policy
Energy policy is a unique topic. Expect this to be diverse, and filled with content. There is of course the generation of energy to speak of, but there is also the conservation of energy. Expect this topic to actually scare you as I am going to be putting science to the test in here, and showing some great knowledge.

Let me talk of energy conservation. Did you know AT&T is marketing a new power charger that will not use energy when there is not a phone plugged in? Well they are... probably in response to the Government ad about unplugging phone chargers when not using them.

A quote from AT&T:
Mobile phone users probably don

Everything bad in the economy is now Obama's fault. Every job lost, all the debt, all the lost retirement funds. All Obama. Are you happy now? We all get to blame Obama!
Kemp currently not being responded to until he makes CONCISE posts.
Avogardo and Noir ignored by me for life so people know why I do not respond to them. (Informational)

Re: A diatribe against Green Energy Policies

So no greeny or lefty dares try to fight me here?

No one at all?

Everything bad in the economy is now Obama's fault. Every job lost, all the debt, all the lost retirement funds. All Obama. Are you happy now? We all get to blame Obama!
Kemp currently not being responded to until he makes CONCISE posts.
Avogardo and Noir ignored by me for life so people know why I do not respond to them. (Informational)

Re: A diatribe against Green Energy Policies

http://www.withouthotair.com/

interesting book about that subject

Tobi

Re: A diatribe against Green Energy Policies

/me saw a massive post and decided to ask what is a diatribe?

Insane Lemming of Drama Queens and Other Hyperbolical People

1431 ftw

Re: A diatribe against Green Energy Policies

it makes no sence to argue here. Sure every way to produce energy has flaws...
You talk about dead birds at windmills.. i wonder how many fish died because of oil in the gulf of mexico now. And how many birds?

We can allways find arguments to discredit the opposition.

About your nuclear reactors, there was 3 mile island which almost was a real real bad accident. You had luck there.
What do we do with the nuclear waste? Atm we put it into some dark hole and let it there for the next generations to deal with it...
Pitty now there is running water into that holes...
I am from europe. I could not play in the sand for a year.. was not allowed to eat anything from outside when chernobyl happened.
So far i was way more effected by the negative effects of nuclear power then i was effected by wind generators.
Many windmills are around my hometown.. I never saw masses of dead birds.

Re: A diatribe against Green Energy Policies

Three Mile Island...

Your in a car, you hit someone else. The seatbelt fails, the airbags work.

Is that luck? Or design? When you have multiple failsafes, and one fails, typically everyone says boo on the flaw, not hurrah on the part that worked.

Three Mile Island worked within its design after a problem. Less radiation from it than background radiation escaped.



As for nuclear now, we have technologies now to take 99.999% of the radioactivity away. The remaining mass is no danger at all.




Fish in the ocean... oil floats on top, not bottom. Fish they float on top, not in center? So fish now breath air?

This is run away government trying to be in control. It is unsafe to fish, not unsafe to be a fish right now. The area does have birds in danger, but not walruses and such.

Generally such accidents are going way down. Generally we can use technology to our advantage here. Heck I keep saying, give me a cork, one of those robot subs, and I will shut it off for a while. No one here seems willing to work outside the box. What about bombing the pipes at ground entry? Or dumping some clotting material into the pipes directly?


And what sort of wind power do you have?

Everything bad in the economy is now Obama's fault. Every job lost, all the debt, all the lost retirement funds. All Obama. Are you happy now? We all get to blame Obama!
Kemp currently not being responded to until he makes CONCISE posts.
Avogardo and Noir ignored by me for life so people know why I do not respond to them. (Informational)

Re: A diatribe against Green Energy Policies

"As for nuclear now, we have technologies now to take 99.999% of the radioactivity away. The remaining mass is no danger at all."

do we?

Tobi

Re: A diatribe against Green Energy Policies

Yes, the technology was made in France in the late 90's. Now it's part of any Western Reactors being made I believe.

The Japanese made a Nuclear reactor that can fit in a 2 car garage and power a neighborhood. So safe they have no worries about it.

Everything bad in the economy is now Obama's fault. Every job lost, all the debt, all the lost retirement funds. All Obama. Are you happy now? We all get to blame Obama!
Kemp currently not being responded to until he makes CONCISE posts.
Avogardo and Noir ignored by me for life so people know why I do not respond to them. (Informational)

Re: A diatribe against Green Energy Policies

I think this would be the goal. Just to tap into a sufficient amount. Just need to keep improving the efficiency of photovoltaic cells

"The amount of energy trapped by photosynthesis is immense, approximately 100 terawatts:[3] which is about six times larger than the power consumption of human civilization.[4] "

2011 IC League Fantasy Football Champion
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http://www.ic-wiki.com/index.php?title=Gondor

Re: A diatribe against Green Energy Policies

Can you imagine if they built a solar array in Earth's orbit and did some kind of tether to the ground? lol. Would be the most efficient way to get power from the sun

2011 IC League Fantasy Football Champion
2012 IC League Fantasy Football Runner Up
2013 IC League Fantasy Football Champion

http://www.ic-wiki.com/index.php?title=Gondor

Re: A diatribe against Green Energy Policies

Legitimate green energy concerns have been hijacked by those who want to use "green" policy as a means for attaining more power. Just as people are quick to point out the conflicts of interest that can exist when big business funds research, people need to be aware that government funding brings the same conflict.

Hey Johnny. If your research finds that regulating x could have benefits and that my agency is the best one to regulate it, I've got a boatload of cash to fund more research projects and keep you getting that professional salary for years! The increase in publications will get you raises and tenure! I hope your findings are to my liking!

I don't see any particular way to avoid conflicts of interest, as they come from all sides (business, government, and even personal bias), except our astute readings of the research themselves. Only in the discourse of studies refuting studies lies the truth. I hope you know how to read serious academic work. I'm sure all voters do and put in the time to know that they're not voting for bullshit... nnnnnope, we're enacting all kinds of bullshit right now. Ignorance is bliss until you end up with a Soviet standard of living. Spain, here we come! Thanks for the hints on how to ruin our economy by spending on "green jobs."

[I wish I could obey forum rules]

Re: A diatribe against Green Energy Policies

Gondor do you support deforestification for Solar panels then?

Or how much a percentage of Earth are you willing to use?




You do know there is a bottleneck in silicon wafer production which would mean just meeting just the US needs would require 100% of currenr production for 20 years right? And that the average life span is about 20 years as well, right?


I think I would miss having cd's for games for 100 years also sad

Everything bad in the economy is now Obama's fault. Every job lost, all the debt, all the lost retirement funds. All Obama. Are you happy now? We all get to blame Obama!
Kemp currently not being responded to until he makes CONCISE posts.
Avogardo and Noir ignored by me for life so people know why I do not respond to them. (Informational)

Re: A diatribe against Green Energy Policies

Ok to make it short, some parts of the oil actually sink down. there they get eaten by micro organisms which get eaten by for example fish. that way the toxic parts of the heavy oil become part of the ecological cycle. the fish may not die directlly, but slowly.

here at my city we have these windmills:
http://commondatastorage.googleapis.com/static.panoramio.com/photos/original/20695121.jpg

the national birdprotection thingy of brandenburg is recording all found dead birds close to windgenerators in whole germany since 1989.
So far 681 dead birds where recorded.
Some other bird expert is saying the number is too low because most corps simply never will be found (sounds not unlogical to me). He is expecting the real number  to be somewhere between 10000 and 100000 dead birds a year. With 20000 wingenerators installed in germany atm thats 0.5 - 5 dead birds each windgenerator.

"Various power companies are quoted as saying that dead bird cleanup constitutes the majority of their maintenance costs."

If this sentence is true its just one big argument that shows maintenance cost of windmills is super low.

Re: A diatribe against Green Energy Policies

50 turbines in New York in a one year study killed 123 birds and 326 bats. That would be 9 per turbine.

Regulations require full clean up of dead animals resulting from business activities and over burdensome identification of the bird, special proper disposal, and notification procedures. It would not be unfair to say 10 business hours are used at all levels per bird killed, as well as lots from people sent out to check for dead birds.

There is a huge difference, admittedly, between us and Euro policies in this regards.

Everything bad in the economy is now Obama's fault. Every job lost, all the debt, all the lost retirement funds. All Obama. Are you happy now? We all get to blame Obama!
Kemp currently not being responded to until he makes CONCISE posts.
Avogardo and Noir ignored by me for life so people know why I do not respond to them. (Informational)

15 (edited by Matrix 04-May-2010 23:31:32)

Re: A diatribe against Green Energy Policies

"Yes, the technology was made in France in the late 90's. Now it's part of any Western Reactors being made I believe.

The Japanese made a Nuclear reactor that can fit in a 2 car garage and power a neighborhood. So safe they have no worries about it."


sry did understand you wrong (stupid english)
thought you said 99,999% of the nuclear waste can be destroyed
my bad

Tobi

Re: A diatribe against Green Energy Policies

> Einstein wrote:

> 50 turbines in New York in a one year study killed 123 birds and 326 bats. That would be 9 per turbine.

Regulations require full clean up of dead animals resulting from business activities and over burdensome identification of the bird, special proper disposal, and notification procedures. It would not be unfair to say 10 business hours are used at all levels per bird killed, as well as lots from people sent out to check for dead birds.<<

Mit nukleer povr, der turbines ked sspin mit mach sschnell und ssssslautr der birds und bats mit sech pressisshun dat der vud be no point in ID und no nid fer disposl

/wipes slobber
/slaps evil hand

The core joke of Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy is that of course no civilization would develop personal computers with instant remote database recovery, and then waste this technology to find good drinks.
Steve Jobs has ruined this joke.

Re: A diatribe against Green Energy Policies

I thot I saw a puddy cat, I did I did saw a puddy cat.

It ated thr poor littel chopped birdy, bad puddy cat!

Everything bad in the economy is now Obama's fault. Every job lost, all the debt, all the lost retirement funds. All Obama. Are you happy now? We all get to blame Obama!
Kemp currently not being responded to until he makes CONCISE posts.
Avogardo and Noir ignored by me for life so people know why I do not respond to them. (Informational)

Re: A diatribe against Green Energy Policies

as for waste, 99.999% of it is the reduction of radioactivity in the waste. It is very safe to transport, to dispose of in local waste refusal area's and poses no danger. Though there are many uses possible for the waste as well.

Everything bad in the economy is now Obama's fault. Every job lost, all the debt, all the lost retirement funds. All Obama. Are you happy now? We all get to blame Obama!
Kemp currently not being responded to until he makes CONCISE posts.
Avogardo and Noir ignored by me for life so people know why I do not respond to them. (Informational)

19 (edited by NaKuShItA 05-May-2010 01:50:02)

Re: A diatribe against Green Energy Policies

only read a small part about this.

i have read somewhere that the USA is busy with a new energy source.

Not sure what it is called, or how it works.
but from what i've read is that it uses lasers.

They aim lasers on something and it recreates a sunlike power. - this power will only be there for a milisecond or something. - the laser needs to recharge again. it takes 5 hours to do so.

the idea is to be able to recharge the laser faster and faster so they can use this sun like power more and more.
i dont have a source as its been a while since i read this.

i think it was called fussion ............  << something.

The building will be done in 2020. so it will take a while smile

Re: A diatribe against Green Energy Policies

Fusion yes, theoretical in function.


Testing has gone on, so far takes more power than generated, but they have had success.

Everything bad in the economy is now Obama's fault. Every job lost, all the debt, all the lost retirement funds. All Obama. Are you happy now? We all get to blame Obama!
Kemp currently not being responded to until he makes CONCISE posts.
Avogardo and Noir ignored by me for life so people know why I do not respond to them. (Informational)