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Re: Metadebating, Part 1: Why are you here?

> Zarf BeebleBrix wrote:

> 1: Logic is still meant as a way to determine the approach.  If you want to kill people, you have to somehow determine a method to most effectively do so.  Otherwise, you're doomed to failure.>

Right. Logic can weigh the costs and benefits of your perceived options, and most people pursue the one that has the fewest risks and costs and highest returns. However, it isn't telling you what to do. It is telling you that if you want a, then you must do xyz.

<2: How do you deal with conflicting desires, then?>

That's why we have diplomacy and its many options for conflict resolution.

<3: How about the way society as a unit should move?  Is there a collective emotion, aside from those associated with major events, such as 9/11 or victory at WW2?>

It can't decide that. It may be able to predict the outcome based on conditions prevalent in humanity and the circumstances faced by one or more human societies.

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Re: Metadebating, Part 1: Why are you here?

> Justinian I wrote:

> > Zarf BeebleBrix wrote:

> 1: Logic is still meant as a way to determine the approach.  If you want to kill people, you have to somehow determine a method to most effectively do so.  Otherwise, you're doomed to failure.>

Right. Logic can weigh the costs and benefits of your perceived options, and most people pursue the one that has the fewest risks and costs and highest returns. However, it isn't telling you what to do. It is telling you that if you want a, then you must do xyz.


But emotion is telling you what to do?  You can ignore an emotion or value just as easily as you can ignore a logical chain.


<2: How do you deal with conflicting desires, then?>

That's why we have diplomacy and its many options for conflict resolution.


1: What guides diplomacy?
2: What tells people to pursue diplomacy in the first place?
3: How about internal conflicting desires?


<3: How about the way society as a unit should move?  Is there a collective emotion, aside from those associated with major events, such as 9/11 or victory at WW2?>

It can't decide that. It may be able to predict the outcome based on conditions prevalent in humanity and the circumstances faced by one or more human societies.



Just checking you on this.  tongue

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Re: Metadebating, Part 1: Why are you here?

Texas has a very firm grasp of diplomacy.  It's called Smith&Wesson.

Emotion and logical explanation.  Our current court system is you can be judged by a jury of your piers.  And jury's just love emotional arguements.  You can literally boar a jury to death with logic.  You feel for the victim, you curse the villian.  Which is why most victims get record levels of monetary funds for damages.  Even though they might not deserve that much extra money.  I mean, if I could get $2 million dollars for "emotional damages", I would have sued my work place a long time ago.  But it just wouldn't be right.

=^o.o^= When I'm cute I can be cute.  And when I'm mean, I can be very very mean.  I'm a cat.  Expect me to be fickle.

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Re: Metadebating, Part 1: Why are you here?

> Key wrote:

> I am not an emotionless robot, meant to have a "logical" discussion.  If I wanted a logical discussion we would genetically been born Vulcans and lived in a world called Star Trek.  If our nations leaders can't reason logically, why the hell are we supposed to? <


Other people not being bothered to set a good example doesn't mean you can't be bothered either, it means you should be bothered.

Word.

"So, it's defeat for you, is it? Someday I must meet a similar fate..."

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Re: Metadebating, Part 1: Why are you here?

There is always something that will "push someone's button".  No matter how hard you try to control the situation.

=^o.o^= When I'm cute I can be cute.  And when I'm mean, I can be very very mean.  I'm a cat.  Expect me to be fickle.

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Re: Metadebating, Part 1: Why are you here?

Thats called person control, if they can't do that then why are they trying to have an adult discussion?

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57 Reply by V. Kemp (edited by Blind Guardian 30-Apr-2010 00:01:27)

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Re: Metadebating, Part 1: Why are you here?

"What do you contribute to the Politics forum through your presence here?"

Awesome. I contribute awesome.

The goal of any ideal political discussion is a break-down of positions and determinants of why who holds what position. It's an adult discussion in which all participants are offered a better understanding of why those who hold other positions hold those positions. Offered is additional supporting reason and evidence for those positions.

For instance, I used to question people over the abortion issue to find the fundamentals people disagreed on, which cuts through the ignorant bullshit and name-calling. I don't care one way or another whether your people kills their kids. Not my problem. But I can dissect an argument into real positions which respond to one another. It doesn't make people agree, but at least they can agree on what they disagree about. We can do a lot better than "baby killer!" vs "women demand the right to kill their kids!"

But most children cannot. So welcome to the IC politics forum! Ha ha ha.

Edit: I used to enjoy making fun of Justinian I's Nordic gods, but that got old after about 5 years. tongue

[I wish I could obey forum rules]

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