Topic: I've decided I believe in God

I find the theories of abiogenesis inadequate and I don't give a crap about what happened after that. The lack of explanation for the formation of the first life form is a death sentence for atheism. I find the idea of existence intriguing. In truth, God existing is no stranger then matter and energy existing. A meaningless universe shouldn't exist at all.

The strangest thing of all is consciousness. I find the concept of consciousness ridiculous when explained from a secular perspective. Life created by chance wouldn't really have choice. Actions and events would be carried out in much the same fashion as a rock rolls down a cliff. Surely the rock doesn't have a conscious and neither should a chemical reaction in a test tube. If a bunch of rocks rolling down a hill doesn't have an awareness then neither should a bunch of chemical reactions contained in a fleshy sack labeled as humans have an awareness.

Yes I pray. Yes I often find my prayers are answered. I'm going to stick with that and go enjoy life.

Rehabilitated IC developer

Re: I've decided I believe in God

Are you taking the piss out of Justinian?


:S

I am sKoE
Do you know what the chain of command is here? It's the chain I go get and beat you with to show you who's in command.

Re: I've decided I believe in God

I take it you're not being serious?

Only the dead have seen the end of war. - Plato

Re: I've decided I believe in God

petrol
...stay off crack.

Re: I've decided I believe in God

Ok,but why praying?
You don

The inmates are running the asylum

Re: I've decided I believe in God

you dont know God's Agenda, maybe if you pray to him you get 50 virgins in your next life...

Re: I've decided I believe in God

regardless of existance or not, the only thing to be cretain of, is my own existence.  That being said, i think we're nothing but mere animals(perhaps created by god or radiated oxyidated carbon), Humans evolved consousnous' because that ability is more favourable in nature, therfore, we humans proliferated until we dominated.

if god created all life, does the H1N1 go to hell when it kills an inocent child? since when is Gods' favors exlusive to only humans? what about an animal that does not have the ability to pray, such as a cat? to they stay in purgatory for not believing?

all i'm saying, is IF god exists, would i be punished for not believing? considering that i was born with the right to choose not to? and if god doesn't like sin and non-believers, why did he create us in the first place?

above all, who says God even cares about us? it has been said that the most simplest answer is the best one.  could it be possable that god created life for entertainment, or even on accident? 

i respect your right to believe in god. but isn't it just as likely for you to be wrong just as much as an atheist can be wrong? given that logic, do you think that our definition of right and wrong may be totally different from God's point of view? is it possable that all of your prayers annoy the hell out of him? and i go to heaven cuz i left him alone, and you bothered him too much and you go to hell?

i'm kinda jumping all over the place because i have so many questions, as you did with us atheists. please take my questions seriously, because i expect a serious answer, i'm not knocking your faith, i'm simply asking hard questions to have a better understanding of your reasons.

I dont smoke cigarettes because i like them.  I smoke because it hides the smell of marijuana thats seeping into the hallway atm.

8 (edited by avogadro 22-Dec-2009 23:15:13)

Re: I've decided I believe in God

"Humans evolved consousnous' because that ability is more favourable in nature, therfore, we humans proliferated until we dominated."

we are the only species that has evolved consournous', right? if it is a favourable ability, you would think that more species would of evolved it...  it would be like only 1 species of birds ever existed or something...

"f god created all life, does the H1N1 go to hell when it kills an inocent child? since when is Gods' favors exlusive to only humans? what about an animal that does not have the ability to pray, such as a cat? to they stay in purgatory for not believing?"

the typical religious review is that God created Humans in his own image; not that we physically resemble God but that we have consciousness. heaven, hell, and purgatory are states of consciousness, so only humans would go to any...

"all i'm saying, is IF god exists, would i be punished for not believing? "

you are not punished for not beleiving. God doesnt examine your life and judge you and base whether you go to heaven, hell, or purgatory based on that judgement.  the current view is more like atheists or sinners are kinda like drug addicts... they are addicted to a certain lifestyle, and when death comes, they're gonna pick that lifestyle even if it damns them...

"
above all, who says God even cares about us?"

most religions do... but yes, there is no proof that God cares just like theres no proof that God exists...

"but isn't it just as likely for you to be wrong just as much as an atheist can be wrong?"

based on our limited knowledge, its hard to judge the likiness that God exists...

"given that logic, do you think that our definition of right and wrong may be totally different from God's point of view?"

i dont see what your previous logic has to do with this question, but i do agree that our definition of right and wrong might be totally different from God's....

"is it possable that all of your prayers annoy the hell out of him? and i go to heaven cuz i left him alone, and you bothered him too much and you go to hell?"

i find it hard to beleive a God would be so petty...  also, if something would seriously annoy God, why would he have created it in the first place?

Re: I've decided I believe in God

"we are the only species that has evolved consournous', right? if it is a favourable ability, you would think that more species would of evolved it...  it would be like only 1 species of birds ever existed or something..."

i believe dolphins have developed consousnous. but never mind that... humans are "top-feeders" this means that our proliferation and dominance prevent other species from attaining more dominant than ourselves.

"the typical religious review is that God created Humans in his own image; not that we physically resemble God but that we have consciousness. heaven, hell, and purgatory are states of consciousness, so only humans would go to any... "

thanx for clearing that up.

"i dont see what your previous logic has to do with this question, but i do agree that our definition of right and wrong might be totally different from God's.... "

previous logic was assertained by the logic that mankind was made in god's image and man has different piont of view, so god should too. right?

"i find it hard to beleive a God would be so petty...  also, if something would seriously annoy God, why would he have created it in the first place?"

i agree with that.

I dont smoke cigarettes because i like them.  I smoke because it hides the smell of marijuana thats seeping into the hallway atm.

Re: I've decided I believe in God

Believing in God isn't normal.

But on meth it is.

11 (edited by avogadro 23-Dec-2009 02:08:47)

Re: I've decided I believe in God

"
i believe dolphins have developed consousnous. but never mind that... humans are "top-feeders" this means that our proliferation and dominance prevent other species from attaining more dominant than ourselves."

we have been able to prevent species for becoming more dominant than ourselves for how long? maybe 2k years? a tiny amount of time in terms of evolution...

"
previous logic was assertained by the logic that mankind was made in god's image and man has different piont of view, so god should too. right?"

ah, ok, i think i see what you're saying..i would simply take a look at the world. acknowledge that there are many parts that we consider bad or evil, and if an all powerful being thought so too, he would probably not of created them.... and then also it seems fairly unlikely that an all powerful being and humans would share the exact same values...

12 (edited by Justinian I 23-Dec-2009 02:18:12)

Re: I've decided I believe in God

OP has terrible logic. Since when is "don't know" reason to believe in God? WTF!

Re: I've decided I believe in God

Perhaps he is saying that because there is such a void in truth, such a
gap between what we know and what we think, that perhaps that void
could be filled with an unknown belief -- since we are only on this planet
for less then 100 years anyway, why not just pick a random belief (in this
case God) and just stick with it.

Or he could be on crack...

I am sKoE
Do you know what the chain of command is here? It's the chain I go get and beat you with to show you who's in command.

Re: I've decided I believe in God

Say that there really is a God. Why is he worth my devotion and prayers? Is his ego equal in size to his creation?

Je maintiendrai

Re: I've decided I believe in God

he is an infinte being, he isnt rewarded with your devotion and prayers... you're rewarded with your devotion and prayers...

16 (edited by ☭ Fokker 23-Dec-2009 13:59:34)

Re: I've decided I believe in God

"Why would God want to prove his existence to you?"

"Because he wants me to worship him."
__________

@Petrolstone
  Well done!

"So, it's defeat for you, is it? Someday I must meet a similar fate..."

Re: I've decided I believe in God

Ok with regards to the title you don't "decide" to believe anything, you either do or you don't.  If your belief is a concious choice it means you're lying to yourself.  For example I choose to believe that the universe is balanced in terms of good and evil, I know it isn't but it's a pleasant delusion.

"I find the theories of abiogenesis inadequate and I don't give a crap about what happened after that. The lack of explanation for the formation of the first life form is a death sentence for atheism."

No.  The lack of information is just that, a lack of information and holds little to no bearing on whether or not God exists.  Before we knew what caused thunder and lightning people believed it was the work of God, clearly they were wrong.  Being unable to prove A true, or even proving it false, does not validate B.  For example if given the equation 2x + 4 = 13 I come up with the answer of x = 3 (and fail elementary math) while someone else comes up with x = 7 (also fails math) does my answer being wrong make his right?  The only possible "death sentence" for atheism would be undeniable, empirical proof of God's existence, which given the nature of God isn't possible.

"Life created by chance wouldn't really have choice."

Who says we do?  What we perceive as choice may simply be our inability to understand all the factors of our existence that lead us to a single unavoidable outcome.

There are 10 kinds of people in this world, those who understand binary and those who don't.

Re: I've decided I believe in God

"we have been able to prevent species for becoming more dominant than ourselves for how long? maybe 2k years? a tiny amount of time in terms of evolution... "

more like 10k years, our competetors were the cro-magnum-man, neanderthal and austropithicacene. they either assimilated or we killed them. historical evidence was not maintained because this happened before we settled our first cities and paper was not invented, which brings me to another piont...

THE BIBLE WAS MAN MADE!

"The lack of explanation for the formation of the first life form is a death sentence for atheism"

the lack of explaination for the formation of the first lifeform is a death sententance for theism too, thanks DPS for helping me realize that. smile

I dont smoke cigarettes because i like them.  I smoke because it hides the smell of marijuana thats seeping into the hallway atm.

Re: I've decided I believe in God

the neanderthal wasnt assimilated and wasnt killed off, they died on their own... i dont know enough about the others, and the three examples you gave are very closely related... you dont see any more foreign species developing it, like you do with other advantageous features...

Re: I've decided I believe in God

"the neanderthal wasnt assimilated and wasnt killed off, they died on their own... "

why did they die on their own? because we humans forced them away, their population was severed and the could not mate enough outlast the homo-sapien.

survival for the fittest and we are here.

I dont smoke cigarettes because i like them.  I smoke because it hides the smell of marijuana thats seeping into the hallway atm.

Re: I've decided I believe in God

they died on their own because there was a climate change and food in the wooded areas became scarce, they needed to hunt on the open plains,  but the neanderthals were quite bad at that.

22 (edited by Justinian I 23-Dec-2009 22:00:20)

Re: I've decided I believe in God

No but the introduction of humans into Europe caused a shortage of resources because humans enjoyed competitive advantages that they did not.

Morbo,

Yeah I figured that. But still it's terrible logic. DPS explained it quite well smile.

Re: I've decided I believe in God

this is so gonna be fun, 3 different stories of how the neanderthals went extinct from 3 people, none citing sources...

Re: I've decided I believe in God

in my archeaology class, i learned that it was believed that the homo-sapien birth rate was much higher than the neanderthals'. As the clever homo-sapiens moved into europe, the neanderthal man basically ran out of room.

also the neanderthal mans' cognitive abilities prevented the possablity of assimilation. basically they were dumbasses and stupidity is unfavourable for survival. 

now, to relate this back to the origional topic, if the neaderthal was smarter and still alive to this day, would the christian church recognize their right? would they be under the juristiction of God even though they are not human?

iv'e heard alot of arguements saying that only humans have soul's. does this mean the neaderthal-man did not survive because they dont have souls? where do they fall in the "man over beast" philosophy?

I dont smoke cigarettes because i like them.  I smoke because it hides the smell of marijuana thats seeping into the hallway atm.

25 (edited by Levitas 28-Dec-2009 09:16:18)

Re: I've decided I believe in God

Some of the other theories include that homo-sapien actually bred with neanderthals. 

As a practicing agnostic, I'm pretty much cool with every religion.  You want to worship a watermelon and you're not hurting anyone and you're not trying to convert everything under the sun to your way of thinking?  Fine, have fun. 

I find the idea of faith fascinating.  My main beef with most of the religions we have on this mixed up world is that they say other religions are wrong.  There are two possibilities ...

1. God exists
2. God doesn't exist

You'll find out when you die, stop worrying about it and live life by the only rule every religion embraces ...

The Golden Rule - DON'T BE A DICK!

Current Status: Done with Imperial Conflict