26 Reply by avogadro (edited by Skyroshroud 04-May-2010 16:44:00)

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Re: medical marijuana

> Toothache911 wrote:

> For another thing, pot does in fact NOT have twice the amount of recognized cancer causing toxins. Please source that because if that came out during one of the 1920 weed reports, its been proven false. Besides, weed is a plant and ciggarettes have tobacco that is mixed with many of the harmful carcinogens. To say that weed is worse than ciggarettes is a blatent misconception.

No way we can pay off our naiton debt that quickly, obviously. But it certainly can help. Besides, since we're talking about medicinal marijuana and not recreational, its odd to assume everyone in the nation is going to be widely addicted (as with alcohol and tobacco).

Politicians lose much from the industry because marijuana and its hemp product can run some industries to the ground. For example, hemp fiber wood is twice as pliable and strong as normal wood, and decomposes in a landfill in 30 or so days. If this product became widely produced, it would run many forresting industries into the red. (and it made the top 100 inventions of all time)


In no way am i saying weed is good for you. But in comparison to drugs already sold under perscriptions, and compared to alcohol and ciggarettes, weed is a diamond in the rough. Its been painted harshly for a long, long time, but studies are finally coming out proving many of the 1920 studies wrong.


i said pot SMOKE has twice the amount... ingestion such as special brownies are probably much less harmful.... tongue
http://www.well.com/user/woa/fspot.htm and its source is National Institute on Drug Abuse, 1984.

California probably has the most liberal pot laws in the country and we know how [moo] they are economically.... it is unlikely it will have any significant effect on the economy...

if pot was an industry, the money politicians would loose from other industries because of the pot industry would most likely be replaced by the pot industry...

i have already addressed the point of it not being as bad as other prescriptions...there are more harmful things that people can legally obtain. but just because legal things can be more dangerous, isnt a reason in itself to legalize it. The last thing any of us should want would be another widely used, harmful drug. we dont need another alcohol or tobacco. While medicinally it is sometimes a good option, i dont think the mild benefits it can have compared to other drugs justifies the risk of increased abuse of the product outside of medicinal use legalizing it would have.

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27 Reply by avogadro (edited by avogadro 02-Dec-2009 20:10:15)

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Re: medical marijuana

> Toothache911 wrote:

> and do you really think if it became medicinal that it would be more widely used? Polls show that 49% of people by age 50 have tried it and I know for a fact the number of people who've tried Oxycodone (legal drug) by age 50 is lower.


it is already medicinal in many states, and i beleive making it available medicinally makes its availability for abuse much wider...

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Re: medical marijuana

yo im high as hell, who has twinkies?

> Justinian I wrote:
> Ouro,
Even though you were the first one to arrive at the scene who clearly pwned Einstein and showed how biased he is, you are an outright arsehole.

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Re: medical marijuana

Err you see I just think that you're misinformed, or at least hung up on old data.

Many people think smoking marijuana is just as harmful as smoking tobacco, but this is not true. Those who hold that marijuana is equivalent to tobacco are misinformed. Due to the efforts of various federal agencies to discourage use of marijuana in the 1970's the government, in a fit of "reefer
madness," conducted several biased studies designed to return results that would equate marijuana smoking with tobacco smoking, or worse.

For example the Berkeley carcinogenic tar studies of the late 1970's concluded that "marijuana is one-and-a-half times as carcinogenic as tobacco." This finding was based solely on the tar content of cannabis leaves compared to that of tobacco, and did not take radioactivity into consideration. (Cannabis tars do not contain radioactive materials.) In addition, it was not considered that:

1) There's not one scientifically credible link between smoking weed and lung cancer
2) Smokers only smoke the bud of the leafing plant. When that is taken into consideration, weed has 33% as much tar as tobacco.
3) While tobacco closes small airways in the lungs, weed does not. In fact, it dialates the aveoili in the lungs which is why many asthma suffers smoke marijuana for relief.
4) Marijuana does NOT contain nicotine, and therefore is inconcievably less addictive than ciggarettes

Many of the reasons marijuana reform has not passed is because of the common misconceptions about the drug. During "reefer madness" of the 70's a number of reports spread false information about the plant and its health effects. While I do think further research should be done, there is overwhelming evidence that marijuana can help those medically ill, or at least better than what we currently have.

Music is passion, energy, creativity, and...well... almost always better on drugs ;-)

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Re: medical marijuana

I've never seen someone die from smoking too much weed.
MANY people have died from drinking too much alcohol...


Either ban alcohol and smokes, or unban weed. Saying that one
is more harmful then another is irrelevant since alcohol will still
kill more people, harmful or not.

In fact, both alcohol and weed have medically improving properties. What
enhancing properties does smokes have?

I am sKoE
Do you know what the chain of command is here? It's the chain I go get and beat you with to show you who's in command.

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Re: medical marijuana

improving the wealth for companies selling it and a source of revenue for governments.  ..... nothing

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Re: medical marijuana

> Morbo the Annihilator wrote:

> I've never seen someone die from smoking too much weed.
MANY people have died from drinking too much alcohol...


Either ban alcohol and smokes, or unban weed. Saying that one
is more harmful then another is irrelevant since alcohol will still
kill more people, harmful or not.

In fact, both alcohol and weed have medically improving properties. What
enhancing properties does smokes have?



there are more harmful things that people can legally obtain. but just because legal things can be more dangerous, isnt a reason in itself to legalize it. The last thing any of us should want would be another widely used, harmful drug. we dont need another alcohol or tobacco. While medicinally it is sometimes a good option, i dont think the mild benefits it can have compared to other drugs justifies the risk of increased abuse of the product outside of medicinal use legalizing it would have.

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33 Reply by avogadro (edited by avogadro 02-Dec-2009 23:09:10)

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Re: medical marijuana

> Toothache911 wrote:

> Err you see I just think that you're misinformed, or at least hung up on old data.

Many people think smoking marijuana is just as harmful as smoking tobacco, but this is not true. Those who hold that marijuana is equivalent to tobacco are misinformed. Due to the efforts of various federal agencies to discourage use of marijuana in the 1970's the government, in a fit of "reefer
madness," conducted several biased studies designed to return results that would equate marijuana smoking with tobacco smoking, or worse.

For example the Berkeley carcinogenic tar studies of the late 1970's concluded that "marijuana is one-and-a-half times as carcinogenic as tobacco." This finding was based solely on the tar content of cannabis leaves compared to that of tobacco, and did not take radioactivity into consideration. (Cannabis tars do not contain radioactive materials.) In addition, it was not considered that:

1) There's not one scientifically credible link between smoking weed and lung cancer
2) Smokers only smoke the bud of the leafing plant. When that is taken into consideration, weed has 33% as much tar as tobacco.
3) While tobacco closes small airways in the lungs, weed does not. In fact, it dialates the aveoili in the lungs which is why many asthma suffers smoke marijuana for relief.
4) Marijuana does NOT contain nicotine, and therefore is inconcievably less addictive than ciggarettes

Many of the reasons marijuana reform has not passed is because of the common misconceptions about the drug. During "reefer madness" of the 70's a number of reports spread false information about the plant and its health effects. While I do think further research should be done, there is overwhelming evidence that marijuana can help those medically ill, or at least better than what we currently have.


basically what you have stated hasnt contradicted anything i've stated...

i am not arguing that weed is more dangerous then smoking or alcohol. im arguing that the small benefits it can have compared to other drugs is not enough of a reason to legalise it when it would greatly increase the availability of a commonly abused substance...

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Re: medical marijuana

1. Creation of a "new" industry
2. Junk food sales would increase
3. Drug dealers will be removed

#3 is important

There will still be a drug problem, but crime and
more specifically organised crime will drop.

I am sKoE
Do you know what the chain of command is here? It's the chain I go get and beat you with to show you who's in command.

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Re: medical marijuana

> Morbo the Annihilator wrote:

> 1. Creation of a "new" industry
2. Junk food sales would increase
3. Drug dealers will be removed

#3 is important

There will still be a drug problem, but crime and
more specifically organised crime will drop.


this thread is about medicinal pot, is that too complex for you to follow? please stay on topic...

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Re: medical marijuana

Even though, legalizing medicinal marijuana still would still damage drug cartels, but yes we can stay on topic.

Avogadro, you state that there are only small benefits from the drug. However, as I stated above, the drug can help with anorexia, glaucoma, arthritis, asthma, migraines, and even as a simple painkiller.
No single perscription opiate can help with all of these things, as those are just painkillers.

My main incentive for legalizing the medicinal drug is practicality. Someone would have to take 6 different medications to cure all of these conditions above (assuming the chance one person might have them). But even if someone had just two of these conditions, the fact that marijuana can alleviate far more than one issue is extremely significant.

Yes, perhaps the drug will be more widely used than now. Keep in mind though that it is not addictive (while Oxycodone, Loritab, Nicotine, etc is), and it is impossible to overdose on. With ALL of this in mind, it is painfully impractical not to legalize the medicinal drug.

Music is passion, energy, creativity, and...well... almost always better on drugs ;-)

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Re: medical marijuana

lol, you're claiming someone needs to take 3 different drugs for arthritis, migraines, and a simple painkiller? i dont think so. also, making it slightly more convenient for a handful of people every year, isnt an excuse to drastically increase the availability of a drug being abused by millions...

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38 Reply by extreme (edited by extreme 03-Dec-2009 09:23:27)

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Re: medical marijuana

Reverse Psychology.

Tell someone they can't do something, they'll probably try to do it at least once.
Don't tell them they can do it and they probably won't.

If someones doesn't want to smoke they wont.
If they do, why shouldn't they have the right to?



Medical Marijuana around the world:

13 States of USA have legalized medicinal marijuana.
Canada: Medpot patients can grow their own or are given it by the government.
The Netherlands: patients can grow up to 5 plants or supplied with herbal cannabis grown for the government.
Germany: patients can purchase Dutch medicinal cannabis from German pharmacies
Spain: patients can grow their own or prescribed Sativex
Israel: patients can grow their own or are supplied with extracts from police seizures.


Another fact.
Portugal have decriminalized the possession of ALL drugs since 2001.

"The paper, published by Cato in April, found that in the five years after personal possession was decriminalized, illegal drug use among teens in Portugal declined and rates of new HIV infections caused by sharing of dirty needles dropped, while the number of people seeking treatment for drug addiction more than doubled."
http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,1893946,00.html

Its no fun until someone dies.
Cos I need to watch things die.

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Re: medical marijuana

apparently staying ontopic is too difficult for extreme...

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Re: medical marijuana

Are you retarded?

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Do you know what the chain of command is here? It's the chain I go get and beat you with to show you who's in command.

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Re: medical marijuana

I changed my mind!

Legalize marijuana and let it be an industry like any other crop!

...CA state government will destroy it forever like everything else, that'll work better than banning it
also: substance abuse treatment = forever but unemployment and job training ends in months big_smile

The core joke of Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy is that of course no civilization would develop personal computers with instant remote database recovery, and then waste this technology to find good drinks.
Steve Jobs has ruined this joke.

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42 Reply by Ouro (edited by Ouro 03-Dec-2009 16:43:29)

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Re: medical marijuana

> avogadro wrote:

> lol, you're claiming someone needs to take 3 different drugs for arthritis, migraines, and a simple painkiller? i dont think so. also, making it slightly more convenient for a handful of people every year, isnt an excuse to drastically increase the availability of a drug being abused by millions...


i think everyone understands the point you're making, but legalizing it would not "drastically increase availability." I dont know if you smoke or not but the shit can be found everywhere.  i've lived, traveled to, and studied all over and pot was one of the easiest things to obtain.  even if by some miracle the amount of pot available boomed like never before...who the hell cares?  all stoners do is sit around, eat, smoke more, wander around, then pass out.  does this frighten you?  pot isnt coke, or crack, or meth, even if someone decided to get into a car high out of their mind, the only thing that you would notice is driving that closely resembles that of an 80 year old woman, that is, slow.  Pot is also not a miracle drug, sure it helps cancer patients regain appetite and numbs their pain, but no doctor is going to agree that the product of crude combustion inhaled into ones system is good for you.  the fact of the matter is that people wanna smoke it even if they're not sick, for the same reasons they want a beer when they come home from work, to relax, and for that it's fantastic. pot is, by and large, completely harmless, nobody on pot flips out and stabs their mother or immediately transitions to intravenus drugs, they just get high, sit on a couch, and giggle.  you're against that?

> Justinian I wrote:
> Ouro,
Even though you were the first one to arrive at the scene who clearly pwned Einstein and showed how biased he is, you are an outright arsehole.

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Re: medical marijuana

Well stated Ouro. And how was xtreme not staying on topic....? He brought up medicinal marijuana in other countries and showed how it decreased usage of the drug because of reverse psychology. Think of Prohibition. Alcohol is banned and as thus cartels rise and more people get the urge to drink. Think of it like the dont-touch-the-big-red-button approach. If you're banned from touching it, then damn you'll want to just out of curiousity or inner rebellion.

And like Ouro stated before, its seriously not that harmful. Potheads are known for being lazy, but so are people who watch a lot of TV (sober or not). My point being, its not that detrimental to society and it can help people a lot more practically than other drugs. Why not

Music is passion, energy, creativity, and...well... almost always better on drugs ;-)

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Re: medical marijuana

Ty Toothache, I suspected someone would've actually read my post.

The reverse psychology I mentioned obviously referred to someone else post about it being made more available, so on topic.
of it
Medical marijuana around the world.. seems pretty on-topic to me.

Portugal was mentioned because of the note I put underneath it. And as you can see, because of decriminalisation more people are getting help for their problems because one can receive treatment easily without being handed over to police. I know as a recreational drug user if I let myself slip and wanted help, not having the risk of repercussions due to the illegality of (one of many lol) substances would definitely encourage it.

It doesnt take a genius to work out prohibition doesnt work. And costs a hell of a lot to John Tax Payer.

Its no fun until someone dies.
Cos I need to watch things die.

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Re: medical marijuana

not in china tongue

The core joke of Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy is that of course no civilization would develop personal computers with instant remote database recovery, and then waste this technology to find good drinks.
Steve Jobs has ruined this joke.

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Re: medical marijuana

> Toothache911 wrote:

> Well stated Ouro. And how was xtreme not staying on topic....? He brought up medicinal marijuana in other countries and showed how it decreased usage of the drug because of reverse psychology. Think of Prohibition. Alcohol is banned and as thus cartels rise and more people get the urge to drink. Think of it like the dont-touch-the-big-red-button approach. If you're banned from touching it, then damn you'll want to just out of curiousity or inner rebellion.

And like Ouro stated before, its seriously not that harmful. Potheads are known for being lazy, but so are people who watch a lot of TV (sober or not). My point being, its not that detrimental to society and it can help people a lot more practically than other drugs. Why not


he  made two arguments for making pot legal, not making it only medicinal. and he stated several facts abotu what states/countries have what laws regarding it... the only arguments he provided were offtopic...

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Re: medical marijuana

> Toothache911 wrote:

> Well stated Ouro. And how was xtreme not staying on topic....? He brought up medicinal marijuana in other countries and showed how it decreased usage of the drug because of reverse psychology. Think of Prohibition. Alcohol is banned and as thus cartels rise and more people get the urge to drink. Think of it like the dont-touch-the-big-red-button approach. If you're banned from touching it, then damn you'll want to just out of curiousity or inner rebellion.

And like Ouro stated before, its seriously not that harmful. Potheads are known for being lazy, but so are people who watch a lot of TV (sober or not). My point being, its not that detrimental to society and it can help people a lot more practically than other drugs. Why not


he  made two arguments for making pot legal, not making it only medicinal. and he stated several facts abotu what states/countries have what laws regarding it... the only arguments he provided were offtopic...

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Re: medical marijuana

>>Potheads are known for being lazy, but so are people who watch a lot of TV (sober or not). My point being, its not that detrimental to society and it can help people a lot more practically than other drugs. <<

actually the zulus chewed that Devil Red before battle

The core joke of Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy is that of course no civilization would develop personal computers with instant remote database recovery, and then waste this technology to find good drinks.
Steve Jobs has ruined this joke.

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Re: medical marijuana

Geez avo, if you spent more time putting forward your opinions on the topic instead of making the effort of finger-pointing at people for their opinions regarding the topic you might actually have something worth reading, not just summarising the previous pages.


"he  made two arguments for making pot legal, not making it only medicinal. and he stated several facts abotu what states/countries have what laws regarding it... the only arguments he provided were offtopic..."

Of course im gonna state what countries/states already have decrimed/legalized it. Why would I do that? obviously to point out that for everyone person that sees no valid justification for the use of Marijuana medicinally that THEY ARE WRONG, and many countries have made it available. So why shouldn't it be globally medicinally available? where is the general consensus? is it good in some places but not others?

As for the Portugal thing, God, if you can't find the correlation between the reasons for me posting that and the making available of Marijuana medicinally, after reading all the other posts saying sh!t like "more drugs available, more people will do them" (medicinal or not) Portugal proved this wrong. And in effect created a more supportive community towards those users (medicinal or not). How can this be bad?

Its no fun until someone dies.
Cos I need to watch things die.

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