Re: Solution to socio-political-economic strife
Oops, misread it, thought it meant rent and electricity. Even then though the costs are manageable when taking into account how many people usually live in each home. One thing though that I found it very hard to find was actual rent costs of the average Indian family. Every rent costs was catered to western style of living which was in the range of $200-$600 USD a month. I've been searching out for rent costs and I'll have to say. The numbers are erratic. I get everything from $0.50 a day to $2.00 a day from various sources. I also caught this bit of information.
http://www.slate.com/id/2218586/
Which states on the bottom:
"Mindful of this difference, the Indian government uses a flexible poverty line that varies with area of residence. Those who live in rural areas are considered impoverished if they makes less than 66 cents per day; the threshold for city-dwellers is 83 cents per day. India also adjusts the status for people who are cash poor but enjoy family assets, like a house or arable land."
I did a bit more research and I did find this:
http://99acres.com/do/quicksearch/search?sid=UiB8IFFTIHwgUiB8IDEgIzQjfCAgfCBTSCB8IzQjICB8IDEgIzkjfCAgfCBTRUFSQ0ggfCA2MTk3MDE3OCB8ICB8IDEgfCAxMiB8IzUjICB8IDEgIzIjfCAg&sortby=price_a
Granted this is a limited search but it does give us a rough idea. 2000 Rp a month equals about $43. Also note that in many of the descriptions it is stated that the Rent is Negotiable. How much is up to debate however.
I also found this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indian_states_ranking_by_household_size
This is average household density broken down by state. Lowest being 3.5 highest being 5.7
I also started rumbling through the reference sites data source. There's a lot there, haven't had time to read much of it.
http://www.nfhsindia.org/
This is specific data on the region around Mumbai
http://www.nfhsindia.org/NFHS-3%20Data/Maharashtra_report.pdf
If I were to take the 2000 Pp a month cost and then apply that to the average household density of 4.7 for that region, factoring in a theoretical income of $1 a day per working adult and taking into consideration that 1/3rd of the population is underage. This means on average you have 3 working adults per household giving an income of $84.00 USD or 4,046 Rp per month. So lets take this all into consideration and add up so me numbers again.
Previous:
TOTAL Rp 1296
Add:
RENT: Rp 2000
FOOD*: Rp 2745
NEW TOTAL: Rp 6041
*Food costs are estimated to 2 additional adults and 1.7 children are extrapolated to .85 adult at a ratio of 2 child food consumption to 1 adult. This is a very rough estimate though.
While this may initially seem bad it actually works quite well in this simulation. First off I grossly overestimated food costs not taking into account bulk buying and costs of other perishable goods which are often lower in cost than the items I stated. The rent cost is that of your average middle class apartment whose income is in the $2.00 USD range instead of the $1 range per day. I haven't been able to find a reliable source of rent information for pucca's in Mumbai, but from the information I gathered from the Press Information Bureau of India the costs are a lot cheaper. They have their own averaged chart of expenses:
http://pib.nic.in/archieve/others/2008/oct/r2008103101.doc
item group monthly per capita exp. (Rs.)
rural urban
(1) (2) (3)
cereals & cereal substitutes 115 119
pulses & their products 24 32
milk & milk products 56 97
edible oil 27 38
egg, fish & meat 24 34
vegetables 43 57
fruits 12 28
sugar, salt and spices 30 38
beverages, refreshments and 31 74
processed food
food total 363 517
pan, tobacco & intoxicants 18 19
fuel and light 66 117
clothing & footwear 49 83
education 22 92
medical 52 83
misc. consumer goods 39 85
misc. consumer services 55 180
rent 3 67
taxes and cesses 2 11
durable goods 26 59
non-food total 332 795
All items 695 1312
1312Rp = $27.23 at today current exchange rate.
This data is averaged out however. But if you look at the Urban food costs alone it's roughly HALF of what I put up. So if I take that data into consideration into my previous data you get a total monthly cost of around 4300 Rp a month. This is slightly over the $1 a day mark, more like $1.07 which by the way is below the poverty line. Most people in India make between $1-2 USD.
So here is an extrapolated family, complete with depends and rent for a 1b pucca style apartment with an absolute minimum cost of living of $1.07 per day. You are WAY overestimating room costs for your average family in India.
Now lets consider that the majority of Indians make between $1-2 USD a day, lets just say $1.50 for arguments sake. Now you have an income of $126 USD a month or 6000 Rp a month. This gives you a lot more wiggle room to work with in terms of other expenditures. Even if there is a pregnant other at most she'll have is 3-4 children max with an average interval of 36 months per child. The eldest of which is most likely to be working as soon as they hit puberty. But I can think you can reasonable see how even with these factors this family can survive, and survive fairly well.
The incomes here are gross not net, meaning this is their income after taxes, costs are averages out which means taxes there are included as well.
"Why didn't you factor those in?"
I didn't factor in transportation costs due to the fact that it's a relative unknown. It depends on where the person works. Most people travel by foot or bike in India. Those better off use scooters which have a low cost per person or mass transit. Depending on their job their cost vary, Most people though take transportation costs into consideration when getting a job, and thus many if not all have that costs factored into their living expenses separately. Some people may even carpool together, again messing up the numbers.
"Let's also factor in costs of education for the child / babysitting / daycare."
Education for the most part is free. And there are academic scholarships for those who wish to seek them out. Daycare and babysitting? I don't know about over there but useually it's the little cousin or uncle, or aunt, or grandmother that takes this job. Meaning the cost is negligible if non-existent.
"Let's include costs of health care for mother, father, and child."
I included costs of overall wellness in my simulation. I omitted health care because again it's a wild card. There is no way to really average this out and has to be taken up by a case by caste basis. In many cases though I would assume their families would help if need be. Many areas offer free clinics and checkups. While it won't really help in case of a major medical emergency it will help reduce the chance of that said emergency. Hell most families here in the States struggle when they suffer a medical emergency. Most bankruptcies are due to medical bills. Most people thankfully don't even encounter this.
"Let's also include costs of protection money paid to local mafia."
So if it happens in one area it must happen in all areas? Umm no, prove that it's persistent in all poor regions and this may be considered. Conjectures are not facts, no matter how much you want to believe in them.
"Let's also include cost of borrowing."
If people borrow it means they have collateral to borrow which implies some amount of wealth. People who don't have money don't borrow more of it to make ends meet. Usually it's those who live beyond their means that suffer from this. You'll find that the lower income brackets do not suffer from this as much as you would like to believe.
"Let's also include cost of paying taxes.
Yes. They'd have to pay taxes, too."
Already factored into costs. ^.^
"Why don't we just cut to the chase, and admit 10 dollars / day just wouldn't cut it over there for a nuclear family. "
Read above.
"Let's not even consider what would happen if the father died.
Let's not even consider the plight of single-mothers.
Let's not even consider how much they would have to earn to be able to afford to BUY their own home suburban bungalow with backyard, 2 cars, and college education for their child."
Most families don't suffer form the first 2, even from the reports from those regions. Something like 4% of households only have a single parent or something like that. The costs of that large house and 2 cars is a lower than you would think. A monthly income in the range of $500-600 USD in India would suffice.
"Why don't you jus admit that westernization / globalization is a grand failure for the VAST MAJORITY of the human population on planet Earth?"
Cause it isn't. Look at the data yourself.
---
So anyways, from the previous post I omitted housing costs on accident but I overestimated food costs so it balanced out for the most part. Went form $0.97 to $1.07 with housing and dependents. Now if I use the government sponsored chart it comes out to $0.97 again. -.-
Furthermore where else I provided references to my cost estimates you have provided none. So here are your requirements for your next post Xeno:
Prove the cost of daycare is what you say for the average household. If there is a cost at all. I want you to seriously consider families looking after each others kids. I want a report detailing it in.
Secondly prove that pregnant mothers are down for 6 months. No estimates, I want hard concrete facts showing it.
Show me actual costs of education in India. The only reference I found is this:
http://www.indiatogether.org/2007/oct/edu-townedu.htm
Which is 6000 rp for 2 children in a rural area. Urban areas are bound to be cheaper, but even if we take it down to 3000 rp per child it boils down to 8 rp a day or $0.16 USD for a yearly average.
I was going to consider making you prove that housing costs are lower than $100 a month but I believe the housing link I provided showing actual costs is proof enough showing how the estimate form the first reference is over-estimated.
These aren't requests Xeno. They are demands. Stop making up facts and provide hard cold evidence to back it up. If you cannot provide proof then everything you have stated to this point was a fabrication of your overzealous imagination.
Note: All references are for residence in the Maharashtra / Mumbai regions. Costs may vary depending on location.
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