Topic: MI5 Too Stretched

The security service MI5 did not have the manpower to do extra checks on the 7 July ringleader before he carried out the attacks in 2005, a report has said.
But the Intelligence and Security Committee declined to criticise MI5, which it said had other priorities.
It stressed that while officers knew of Mohammad Sidique Khan's terrorist links, there was no evidence to suggest he was a threat to national security.
The Conservatives said there should be a judicial inquiry into MI5's actions.
Fifty-two people were killed in the suicide bombings in London in 2005.
The long-awaited report by a group of MPs describes in unprecedented detail what officers knew of Khan before the attacks.
It reveals that a police surveillance team filmed him in 2001 as part of an operation against suspected extremists.
However, he was not identified from the picture - and his significance was only realised after the bombings.

The report reveals that MI5 teams were stretched almost to breaking point in 2004 - the year before the attacks - attempting to trace terror suspects around the UK.
During that year, MI5 did not have the resources to watch 52 suspects who were classed as "essential targets".
In fact, the security service could only provide "reasonable" surveillance coverage of about one in 20 terror suspects - a fact the committee described as "astounding".
The committee said Khan and fellow 7/7 bomber Shehzad Tanweer were defined as "desirable" targets by MI5 after they were overheard discussing fraud and travel to Pakistan.
But resources were so stretched that officers could not even assess whether such "desirable" targets should be examined more closely unless they were known to be actively plotting an attack.
The committee's chairman, Kim Howells MP, said: "Hindsight is a wonderful thing. Those judgements were made at the time and, having gone in detail through all of the details, we cannot find any reason to criticise the actions that were taken at the time."
He said he hoped the report would put a stop to "speculation" and "conspiracy theories" which had caused distress to the families of the 7/7 victims.

There were six contacts recorded by MI5 and police with Khan between 1993, when he was arrested for assault, and January 2005, when a hire car was linked to a terror investigation.
Surveillance teams also witnessed several meetings between Khan and Tanweer and Omar Khyam, the man later discovered to be the leader of a plot to detonate fertiliser bombs.
Analysts decided the three men were not planning an attack and were instead involved in financial fraud.
   

This to me seems crazy..After reading this i think M15 made several key errors. And i think that if those errors had not been made the 7th of july bombings would not have happend.

Frenzy
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Re: MI5 Too Stretched

No they did not. The error is that England is a sanctuary to extremists from Islam.

I posted a website 2 years back ago which was full of extremists in England, their forum for hecks sake showed a lot of them had intimate close relations with fighters in Afghanistan and Iraq, as well as a closer knowledge of the shifting war front

Everything bad in the economy is now Obama's fault. Every job lost, all the debt, all the lost retirement funds. All Obama. Are you happy now? We all get to blame Obama!
Kemp currently not being responded to until he makes CONCISE posts.
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Re: MI5 Too Stretched

if they don't have the manpower, that's the fault of Parliament for not funding t

hang on doorbell

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Steve Jobs has ruined this joke.

Re: MI5 Too Stretched

However much manpower the security services have it will never be enough to keep tabs on the whole population (or let's hope not anyway!). As a result judgement calls will always have to be made as to which guy is a bigger risk and therefore who to concentrate investigations on and who to back off. A judgement call was made on Sidique Khan to say he wasn't a high enough risk to justify continued investigation. Just because he went on to commit an act of terrorism does not mean that the risk analysis performed was incorrect. I would also suggest that it is in some way encouraging that MI5 had encountered the July 7th bombers previously and that they weren't entirely clueless. It is an indication that they are capable of stopping future events even if this guy slipped through the net.

I'm not trying to defend MI5 because the other interpretation that they are all clueless useless bumbling idiots may well be correct. However, to my mind this story does not give evidence of MI5 mistakes or wrongdoing.

tweehonderd graden, dat is waarom ze me mr. fahrenheit noemen, ik reis aan de snelheid van het licht, ik ga een supersonische man van u maken

Re: MI5 Too Stretched

Although I do reckon MI5 should pay more attention to Flint. He is almost certainly correct in all situations...

tweehonderd graden, dat is waarom ze me mr. fahrenheit noemen, ik reis aan de snelheid van het licht, ik ga een supersonische man van u maken

Re: MI5 Too Stretched

Well thanks Sitting Duck for recognizing this tongue

Now fun aside, I am bothered this report was published. This will set those Islamists into new patterns with efforts to shake any 'tails' they might have. It would not be to overly hard to render the tracking down to at most 10% of the current level with the knowledge there is 52 not watched, and 1 in 20 with 'reasonable' surveillance. If this was published against the Russians when the monster known as the USSR existed, then Putin (who was a KGB chief) would have laughed and thanked England for helping him with future operations in England...

Everything bad in the economy is now Obama's fault. Every job lost, all the debt, all the lost retirement funds. All Obama. Are you happy now? We all get to blame Obama!
Kemp currently not being responded to until he makes CONCISE posts.
Avogardo and Noir ignored by me for life so people know why I do not respond to them. (Informational)

Re: MI5 Too Stretched

Well I would hope that the manpower and resources given to MI5 are determined by doing some kind of cost/benefit analysis to find the optimum size that MI5 should be. Whether or not MI5's deficiencies should be published is another matter, but that is what happens when the public demand reports and transparency.

tweehonderd graden, dat is waarom ze me mr. fahrenheit noemen, ik reis aan de snelheid van het licht, ik ga een supersonische man van u maken