1 Topic by V. Kemp (edited by V.Kemp 10-Feb-2009 00:01:31)

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Topic: Obama to move the U.S. census into the White House

Democrats have long advocated estimating urban populations for the census. This move sounds like a sure way to increase the political power held by Amerika's urban centers. Chief of Staff Rahm Emanuel is known for his scheming; I bet he can accomplish a lot overseeing the Census Bureau. What a coincidence that this move is being enacted just as a token Republican is appointed Commerce Sec.

The Department of Commerce can't hide its methods. The White House is not nearly so required to disclose its workings.

Seeing as the law clearly states that the Census Bureau be run by the Department of Commerce and a multitude of statutes regulate what of its documents can be view by anyone else, I have to wonder what possible explanation Obama can give for this move. I've always been suspicious of Obama. His hiding his studies, his rhetoric-appealing-to-the-ignorant-void-of-actual-substance, his rhetoric of HOPE and CHANGE followed by appointing no one remotely interested in change to any position, his willingness to befriend people who are unapologetic in their actions seeking to kill innocent human beings; someone justify this move. I'm starting to see slime, not just suspect that it has to be all over him.

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2 Reply by Econ (edited by Econamatrix 10-Feb-2009 01:06:15)

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Re: Obama to move the U.S. census into the White House

Great foresight you have there.

Come back to this thread in 1,2, 4, whatever years and tell us if he has increased power and influence for himself and his friends, bought the US economy to its knees, or if he has invaded a country or two. Oh no that's what the last crowd did. Perhaps he'll do something different (the opposite) and we non-american's will be lucky.

edit: I imagine its not just non-americans would be lucky. American's as well I'd say.

Gondor: wtf, im not even mentioned. I was the glue to this family. Thats BS!
Econ: Gondor, if you were the glue, then I was the glue sticky thing that applies the glue.
(edit: I believe that's called the brush).
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3 Reply by Gladiator (edited by Gladiator 10-Feb-2009 01:16:35)

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Re: Obama to move the U.S. census into the White House

Spell America right first. tongue






(I realize this is coming from the worst possible person, but I just wanted to point that out)

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Re: Obama to move the U.S. census into the White House

....
If you are correct I don't see why this is important

I'm going to be nicer promise

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Re: Obama to move the U.S. census into the White House

lol Yeah me neither.

Sex without the e is still SX!

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6 Reply by V. Kemp (edited by V.Kemp 10-Feb-2009 02:26:05)

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Re: Obama to move the U.S. census into the White House

Thank you for that fine example of willful ignorance, Econamatrix. You have no regard for the subject matter of this thread but instead make completely irrelevant references to "the last crowd."

Thank you for your contribution as well, Gladiator. The more people who respond thinking they're posting "in defense" of President Obama who have NOTHING of substance to say, the more it appears you have NO explanation for this change.

Maybe it's not important to you that every Commerce Sec. (save Clinton's) has advised strongly against estimation ("sampling") in conducting the census, Question. Maybe it's not important to you that President Obama is politicizing the cenus, which determines Congressional representation and has a large role in determining the distribution of federal funds. I suppose if you just don't care that this method yields inaccurate numbers in whichever direction that the conductor of the census wants it's not important. I suppose if you just don't care that the White House can manipulate these subjective numbers, whereas the Department of Commerce had to publish its methods and regulations (the White House is granted much more secrecy in the way it conducts its business), then it's not important. Thank you for informing us of your apathy.

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Re: Obama to move the U.S. census into the White House

Yeah based on the Census all 50 states will redraw every congressional district, and the House of Representatives will decide which states get how many representatives.  California has 52 right now, the most, out of 435.  Maybe it will lose some.  NY lost 3 10 years ago.  Even if the number of districts stay the same, the map is totally based on population density, ethnicity (can't have all white enclaves!!!!) and economics.

BTW the last census was conducted all year in 2000.  The election wasn't until Nov 4 and Bush didn't take office until January 20 2001. 

This is a dumb move by Obama to appease his political hack base in the urban districts.

The core joke of Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy is that of course no civilization would develop personal computers with instant remote database recovery, and then waste this technology to find good drinks.
Steve Jobs has ruined this joke.

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Re: Obama to move the U.S. census into the White House

I've proposed one corrupt motivation for why Obama has done this. And it's the complete opposite of the transparency Obama has claimed he wants to bring to Washington. I'm eagerly awaiting any alternative reason for this move. 0 have been proposed so far.

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Re: Obama to move the U.S. census into the White House

I would bet against the Liberals here pushing for transparency on everything, when they know some suits their agenda's.

It's just another part of the big lie.


Reverse everything they stand for

They say they want no censorship ---- You hear "I want the Fairness Doctrine, no Religious Books in Libraries, banning Fox News in Canada, and Google to hide Gun Websites"

They say they will be transparent ----- You should realize this means "We will say we will be transparent while we hide even more stuff"

They say they want public polls ---- We both know the phones are off the hook in Washington DC because the overwhelming number of phone calls against the 'Stimulus Bill' and that we will never be polled about it.

They say they want Bi-Partisanship ---- Then we are reminded they won and are expected to act as Democrats, their view of Bi-Partisanship.

They say they will take the hard questions ---- The hardest question Obama was asked finally happened in a town hall meeting by a civilian and not from the media.

They say they are for removing our energy dependence ---- Yet the last thing they want to do is remove our dependence, since drilling is fastest and cheapest, and can bridge us into getting into alt energies cheaper and more efficiently... and they will never drill

They say no more pork or ear marks ---- We see a bill that is nearly 100% of all that pass, in a record size level

Everything bad in the economy is now Obama's fault. Every job lost, all the debt, all the lost retirement funds. All Obama. Are you happy now? We all get to blame Obama!
Kemp currently not being responded to until he makes CONCISE posts.
Avogardo and Noir ignored by me for life so people know why I do not respond to them. (Informational)

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Re: Obama to move the U.S. census into the White House

WTF is he even talking about?

LORD HELP OREGON

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Re: Obama to move the U.S. census into the White House

Obama promised openness and bipartisanship.

Obama sat in a meeting of House Republicans--all of whom got elected in Nov 2008--and told them he'd do it his way because, quote, "I won."

He said all bills would be up on a website 5 days before he signed them. Already failed. Obama's white house website is lamer and slower than Bush's. Bush had transcripts of everything Bush said in public up the same day he said it and archived over all 8 years by subject and setting--press conference, speech, etc--and searchable by date.

The Fairness Doctrine was a federal rule for broadcasters. It says you gotta have equal time for different viewpoints. If you have somebody on your station saying obama will cause inflation, you must give the same airtime to somebody saying Obama won't. If somebody says things 75% of the audience agrees with--"team sports belong in public schools, its all good" the rule means the station must give equal minutes to a view 25% of the audience likes "team sports are a waste, most kids suck" Since anybody can file complaints, the practical effect of the Fairness Doctrine is to eliminate politics from broadcast. Almost all political discussion shows date since the Fairness Doctrine was ended in 1987. Since talk radio is largely rightwing because that is what most radio listeners will listen to, Democrats keep talking about bringing the rule back.

And Democrats are adamant american will not drill new wells offshore, or on federal land, or dig more coal, or build more nuke plants, or put up too many powerlines...

The core joke of Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy is that of course no civilization would develop personal computers with instant remote database recovery, and then waste this technology to find good drinks.
Steve Jobs has ruined this joke.

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Re: Obama to move the U.S. census into the White House

er.... do you have any proof of this because from what I see on the news, papers and internet, you're 100% wrong =/

Sex without the e is still SX!

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Re: Obama to move the U.S. census into the White House

I'm 100% wrong because you can't google and click the first half dozen results? I'm sorry you don't know any decent news media sources to reference and find out what's going on. Please take note of your level of awareness.

"Why Obama Wants Control of the Census "
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB123423384887066377.html?mod=googlenews_wsj
- - - - -

President Obama said in his inaugural address that he planned to "restore science to its rightful place" in government. That's a worthy goal. But statisticians at the Commerce Department didn't think it would mean having the director of next year's Census report directly to the White House rather than to the Commerce secretary, as is customary. "There's only one reason to have that high level of White House involvement," a career professional at the Census Bureau tells me. "And it's called politics, not science."

The decision was made last week after California Rep. Barbara Lee, chair of the Congressional Black Caucus, and Hispanic groups complained to the White House that Judd Gregg, the Republican senator from New Hampshire slated to head Commerce, couldn't be trusted to conduct a complete Census. The National Association of Latino Officials said it had "serious questions about his willingness to ensure that the 2010 Census produces the most accurate possible count."

- - - - -
Funny how the guy who doesn't estimate/sample is the guy who can't give accurate numbers; it's the ones who have no problem making up numbers who we should depend on!

"Obama shifts Census oversight, triggering angry protest by Republicans"
http://www.govexec.com/story_page.cfm?articleid=41986&dcn=todaysnews
- - - - -

The move would shift the chain of command with the bureau and the Commerce Department, where the bureau currently resides. It comes after the Congressional Black Caucus, National Association of Latino Elected and Appointed Officials and other groups expressed displeasure with Obama's nominee for Commerce secretary, Republican Sen. Judd Gregg of New Hampshire.

- - - - -
So he's not just a hypocrite when he talks about transparency, but also when he talks about bipartisanship.
- - - - -

Gregg, the groups said this week, opposed efforts to secure emergency funding for the 2000 Census, which they asserted exposes a potential lack of commitment to ensuring that hard-to-reach minority populations are properly accounted for in the 2010 census.
A White House spokesman confirmed Thursday that Obama plans to work closely with the bureau, which will remain within the Commerce Department.

- - - - -
Oh he'll make sure they're counted. Or not "counted," certainly not, but a bigger than accurate number will be given to them to ensure that they are represented!

I'm sure I could find more sources. Some of you are having trouble. My advice is, just don't vote or post if you have no idea what's going on.

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Re: Obama to move the U.S. census into the White House

whitehouse.gov's press section has 0 mention of it. Why would he hide it? Hello corruption. This is change alright. jk jk

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Re: Obama to move the U.S. census into the White House

"ETHICS

The ethics section is currently being revised to reflect President Obama's Executive Order concerning Ethics Commitments by Executive Branch Personnel, issued on January 21, 2009.  Please check back soon.  "
http://www.whitehouse.gov/agenda/ethics/

So there! 

They've only had 3 weeks...

The core joke of Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy is that of course no civilization would develop personal computers with instant remote database recovery, and then waste this technology to find good drinks.
Steve Jobs has ruined this joke.

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Re: Obama to move the U.S. census into the White House

Wait a second... we all forgot something here.

Kemp, do you mind providing an article saying your above census issue is true?  Not that I'm doubting you, but since the issue at hand is news coverage, we need to know how readily available that news is as a prerequisite issue.

Make Eyes Great Again!

The Great Eye is watching you... when there's nothing good on TV...

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Re: Obama to move the U.S. census into the White House

Kemp, I thought about editing my post after I realized how easy it was to misinterpret.  Of all the things that are going on now I wouldn't understand why moving the census would be important.  big_smile But I was too lazy to write all that.  But more "importantly" I didn't figure you for a conspiracy fellow.  Here, borrow my tin foil hat so they can't read your mind.

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Re: Obama to move the U.S. census into the White House

> V.Kemp wrote:

> Thank you for that fine example of willful ignorance, Econamatrix. You have no regard for the subject matter of this thread but instead make completely irrelevant references to "the last crowd."

I would call it quite relevant. Did you make a thread asking Dick Cheney what he was doing when he decided that he would change things to suit himself and become the most powerful VP in history (I believe)? Luckily Biden isn't interested in following in those footsteps.

I can't find this column that I read a few weeks back, but here is a short quote from a shorter one that I found.

"Among his very first actions last week as US President was to sign a series of orders relating to freedom of information, rules of ethics for his executive staff in relation to lobbyists and lobbying, and transparency and open Government."

http://www.whitehouse.gov/the_press_office/FreedomofInformationAct/
http://www.whitehouse.gov/the_press_office/ExecutiveOrder-EthicsCommitments/
http://www.whitehouse.gov/the_press_office/TransparencyandOpenGovernment/

Seems like he is opening up the White House to me. 3 weeks is not a long time in politics, especially American politics where they start gearing up for the election 2 years out!

Gondor: wtf, im not even mentioned. I was the glue to this family. Thats BS!
Econ: Gondor, if you were the glue, then I was the glue sticky thing that applies the glue.
(edit: I believe that's called the brush).
Torqez: Econ you forgot the part where you say "and I made Torqez delete!"

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19 Reply by Econ (edited by Econamatrix 10-Feb-2009 18:43:30)

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Re: Obama to move the U.S. census into the White House

By the way, you may be interested to know that I have voted towards the right in my own country. But our equivalent of republicans and democrats both sit much closer to the centre. Our conservatives are not dominated by God 'n Guns, and they just voted in an increase in the minimum wage and extra help for lower income families while cutting tax slightly. Our liberals are not as far to the left as the democrats, but compared to the republicans, the democrates seem rather moderate!

To me, yes as an outsider, many republicans come across as extremeists. Dont get me wrong, I have travelled far and wide across the US (I could supply a list if you really wanted, it's quite extensive) and have met a bunch of great great people; including republican's who are not that 'extreme'. But the party does seem that way.

edit: Im not correcting the spelling and grammar, I'll assume you can ignore it.

Gondor: wtf, im not even mentioned. I was the glue to this family. Thats BS!
Econ: Gondor, if you were the glue, then I was the glue sticky thing that applies the glue.
(edit: I believe that's called the brush).
Torqez: Econ you forgot the part where you say "and I made Torqez delete!"

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Re: Obama to move the U.S. census into the White House

goooooo nuke power plants!

TC pwns me

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Re: Obama to move the U.S. census into the White House

I already provided 2 links I got from Googling, Zarf BeebleBrix. There are more.

I've already outlined why it's problematic, Question. No one has yet provided any reason for this other than corruption.

I had a great many problems with Bush and Cheney, Econamatrix. They're not the topic of this thread. What are you smoking? So he signed a "series of orders relating to freedom of information." So what? If you don't know the specifics it's probably because they're not something he wants everyone to know.

>>To me, yes as an outsider, many republicans come across as extremeists. <<

This thread is a fine example of how awful the media you're viewing is. They do not give you an accurate view of the USA.

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22 Reply by V. Kemp (edited by V.Kemp 10-Feb-2009 19:17:25)

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Re: Obama to move the U.S. census into the White House

FYI: I am not registered with a political party. I don't like nearly anyone in national US politics. Some are much better than others. Some seem alright but it's not my work or life and I don't know about the stories of people in all of the lesser positions. This isn't a BASH-OBAMA-RAMA thread. This is a thread about an action he's taking/planning to enact. This is a thread about me finding NO alternative motivation or reason for this change other than corruption. I've explained that this change is problematic legally. I've explained that this change is problematic for politicizing the census. Democrats have long advocated using estimates in the census which the vast majority of commerce secretaries have strongly advocated not using. I'll continue asking for any other motivation/reasons Obama could have for this move other than politicizing the census and using whichever estimates Rahm wants. All of the experts have advised against this method but it's politically advantageous for Obama to use so he's quietly seeking to do it anyway for the 2010 census. I'm still waiting on alternative reasons this is a good idea.

The Office of the President of the United States should do what it can to avoid even the appearance of politicizing such an important task. Here Obama is openly politicizing it against the advice of nearly every Commerce Secretary and no one has thus far even proposed a single alternative reason that this is a good idea, let alone proposed a feasible one.

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23 Reply by Econ (edited by Econamatrix 10-Feb-2009 19:34:57)

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Re: Obama to move the U.S. census into the White House

> V.Kemp wrote:

> What are you smoking? So he signed a "series of orders relating to freedom of information." So what? If you don't know the specifics it's probably because they're not something he wants everyone to know.

So he is opening things up to make it more transparent. My point is maybe once this census move is done, and this order is enforced, perhaps you will know more. Or at least more information will be available to you. I don't profess to be an expert in this, but I am trying to show that he is not all about cover up and you may learn more about the internals goings-on and hear more about the census in the future.

> This thread is a fine example of how awful the media you're viewing is. They do not give you an accurate view of the USA.

I've watched a variety of the news channels. Do you think that any of them are any good? Despite the media also having its own agenda, I can draw my own conclusions based upon a 'Q&A' session, debate etc and most of the time can tell the difference between what is fact and what is media spin to twist those facts to suit themselves. I know what the US is like, as I said Ive travelled there extensively and lived there for a short while.

Gondor: wtf, im not even mentioned. I was the glue to this family. Thats BS!
Econ: Gondor, if you were the glue, then I was the glue sticky thing that applies the glue.
(edit: I believe that's called the brush).
Torqez: Econ you forgot the part where you say "and I made Torqez delete!"

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Re: Obama to move the U.S. census into the White House

V.Kemp wrote:

I'm 100% wrong because you can't google and click the first half dozen results? I'm sorry you don't know any decent news media sources to reference and find out what's going on. Please take note of your level of awareness.

"Why Obama Wants Control of the Census "
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB123423384887066377.html?mod=googlenews_wsj
- - - - -

President Obama said in his inaugural address that he planned to "restore science to its rightful place" in government. That's a worthy goal. But statisticians at the Commerce Department didn't think it would mean having the director of next year's Census report directly to the White House rather than to the Commerce secretary, as is customary. "There's only one reason to have that high level of White House involvement," a career professional at the Census Bureau tells me. "And it's called politics, not science."

The decision was made last week after California Rep. Barbara Lee, chair of the Congressional Black Caucus, and Hispanic groups complained to the White House that Judd Gregg, the Republican senator from New Hampshire slated to head Commerce, couldn't be trusted to conduct a complete Census. The National Association of Latino Officials said it had "serious questions about his willingness to ensure that the 2010 Census produces the most accurate possible count."

- - - - -
Funny how the guy who doesn't estimate/sample is the guy who can't give accurate numbers; it's the ones who have no problem making up numbers who we should depend on!

"Obama shifts Census oversight, triggering angry protest by Republicans"
http://www.govexec.com/story_page.cfm?articleid=41986&dcn=todaysnews
- - - - -

The move would shift the chain of command with the bureau and the Commerce Department, where the bureau currently resides. It comes after the Congressional Black Caucus, National Association of Latino Elected and Appointed Officials and other groups expressed displeasure with Obama's nominee for Commerce secretary, Republican Sen. Judd Gregg of New Hampshire.

- - - - -
So he's not just a hypocrite when he talks about transparency, but also when he talks about bipartisanship.
- - - - -

Gregg, the groups said this week, opposed efforts to secure emergency funding for the 2000 Census, which they asserted exposes a potential lack of commitment to ensuring that hard-to-reach minority populations are properly accounted for in the 2010 census.
A White House spokesman confirmed Thursday that Obama plans to work closely with the bureau, which will remain within the Commerce Department.

- - - - -
Oh he'll make sure they're counted. Or not "counted," certainly not, but a bigger than accurate number will be given to them to ensure that they are represented!

I'm sure I could find more sources. Some of you are having trouble. My advice is, just don't vote or post if you have no idea what's going on.

er....why exactly do you think I was talking to you when there were 3 posts between the one you made and the one I made? lol

Sex without the e is still SX!

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Re: Obama to move the U.S. census into the White House

You sound confused.

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