Topic: Israel & Hezbollah rockets

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080327/ap_on_re_mi_ea/israel_hezbollah

Personally I've always felt that Israel's responses to palistinian/southern lebanese violence have been exagerrated in that their measures resulted in a presumably intended punishment of all palistinians rather than seeking out the guilty ones.

Now this was when the threat from islamists against israelis was based on suicide bombers. These were very local attacks which you can have decent protection from if you put in enough effort, as was shown by the dramatic decline of palistinian suicide attacks after putting up the israeli defence wall. Except for the fact that it is largely constructed on palistinian territory, which was a bit of an jerkish thing to do, this was a very good decision.

Unfortunatly the use of rockets is much harder to defend against and although in due time they will surely come up with some sort of anti-rocket system to defend against it there is as of yet no reliable defence against it.

Except for one sure fire way... to move all suspected palistinians/southern lebanese either out of Israeli rocket range or into areas so completely locked down the people ending up in them would think of the current palestinian territories as a big open prairie. Leaving the ones not suspected to be as they are and start deporting them too if attacks continue. Now to uproot hundreds of thousands of people would clearly be a harsh measure and not warranted right now as the rocket attacks are still more of a tolerable nuisance than anything else, but I would have some sympathy for it if the rocket attacks escalated. After all if representatives of a people, because like it or not the actions of these terrorist groups do represent the wishes of a very large part of their people, would start launching rockets on my home I'd accept and if necessary expect much further reaching actions than moving these people in order to make it stop.

Incidentally this tactic was used with huuuu-ge success by the british forces in both the boer wars and the malaysian emergency.

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Re: Israel & Hezbollah rockets

I kind of like the idea, have Israel, Palestine, and Lebanon have kind of a No-Man's Land along the border where there are no cities, towns, villages, etc. within x miles of the border, with x being a little over 1/2 the range of the rockets they've been using.  This means any launching points would have to be set up in this area making them easy to spot and eliminate.

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Re: Israel & Hezbollah rockets

They could easely get better rockets that fly further away.

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4 (edited by Decimus 27-Mar-2008 17:54:31)

Re: Israel & Hezbollah rockets

how about we build a very high wall for rockets to bounce off? or build a bomb-proof glass sphere over one side? or some sort of magnetic field that explodes all metal objects! yay! it's much more fun concentrating on the effects than the causes!

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Re: Israel & Hezbollah rockets

arocalex
they could get them, not necessarily easily, but that doesn't mean anything. they'd be trying to get their hands on ever longer range missiles anyway, so displacing the population would always be a potential and perhaps even necessary stop-gap solution;

decimus, governments have a duty to protect their citizens. if there are rockets flying over the border of a nation then it is the task of that government to remove the threat; the fact that one would try to prevent this does not mean there couldn't be a multi-pronged strategy with both sticks and carrots, in the malayan emergency for example sequestering a population of roughly five hundred thousand people was only one cornerstone of the strategy

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Re: Israel & Hezbollah rockets

The Israelis got several  anti-missile systems and laser cannons,but its uneconomic to waste them on arab toy rockets .

The inmates are running the asylum

Re: Israel & Hezbollah rockets

Just leave the palestinians alone. Give them back their land and throw the israelians out of palestinia which they have occupied for decades and this would be solved in a year or so and no need for expensive stuff to be built.

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Re: Israel & Hezbollah rockets

The Palestinians want the whole of Israel "returned" to them.

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Re: Israel & Hezbollah rockets

"The Palestinians want the whole of Israel "returned" to them."

Why the quotes?  Israel was original part of Palestine, admittedly not an overly populated part of Palestine, and they had been living there for thousands of years.  Regardless of the state of the Palestinian nation, i.e I don't think they were one, surely you can understand the people claiming ownership.  It's similar in many ways to the Natives of North America, they had no real cities to speak of and weren't a coherent nation but they still claimed ownership, once they learned people actually thought you could own land.

Israel to me doesn't make sense.  What was the conversation like to decide where to put them.

"Ok the Jews have just been horribly persecuted, let's do something nice and give them a country to call their own.  So where are we gonna put it."

"Well obviously none of us are going to give up any of our land."

"Obviously."

"I got it let's give them Ancient Israel."

"Sure we'll give the Jews land which includes a holy city surrounded by Muslims what could possibly go wrong."

Not saying I disagree with giving the Jews a homeland I just don't think the people who did it really thought it through.

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Re: Israel & Hezbollah rockets

Totaly agree with you DPS and as far as I can understand the palestinians would be ok with having palestina for themselves now, but the israelians wont ever give up their occupied land (their MANY settlements on palestinian land).

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Re: Israel & Hezbollah rockets

Great idea except since Israelis have been settling in the West Bank, you may have to move the 2.5 million Palestinians who already live there someplace else which would be the beginning of yet another humanitarian disaster.

Don't know why Israel insists on shielding and supporting its religious fanatics who keep settling the West Bank on the basis of claiming it as the biblical homeland. Guess it doesn't help when Christian fundamentalists in the U.S keep stoking the fire, hoping that the continued occupation by Israel will fulfill arcane prophecy and bring about Armageddon. If they keep it up Armageddon may very well take place though why one would hope for such a thing...

Then again religious fanatics are the same whether it's Tibet, Yugoslavia, the Middle East or segments of the U.S.

Re: Israel & Hezbollah rockets

"Great idea except since Israelis have been settling in the West Bank, you may have to move the 2.5 million Palestinians who already live there someplace else which would be the beginning of yet another humanitarian disaster."

I assume you mean israelis right?

And yea ofc you will have to move them one settlement at the time. But you have to start it, else it will never happen. And yep the US protects Israel for the reason you said, and cause they think that a new Messia gonna be born there. But what happened last time that "happened"? They had him killed so... nice:P

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Re: Israel & Hezbollah rockets

So, when the Palestinians get their land back, who'll be next?  Is Tibet or, Kurdistian, or Hungary on the list?

Re: Israel & Hezbollah rockets

xeno it depends were those nations just given to people or formed as a result of war or settlement.  Israel is unique in that people who had no claim to the land were given a nation.  Think of it like this, say you own a large estate with 100's of acres of land.  Then one day you wake up and find people have started building on half your land.  When you go to the police you find out the government gave them that land without consulting you.  Need I say you'd be quite pissed?  Whether or not that's true it's how the Palestinians view the situation.  Now unless Tibet, Hungary, or Kurdistian were formed in the same manner the dissolution of Israel would not set a precedent for those nations.

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Re: Israel & Hezbollah rockets

1) Displacing that much DPS would pretty much negate 2/3 of the populated Palestine lands and 1/3 of the Israeli lands

2) Seeking out the guilty parties is impossible while Palestinians will hide the terrorists. Act this out in your own city. Goto the far side of your city, act as if you fired a rocket, and find a place 1 mile away in less than 15 minutes. Figure how many places are available for you to hide at.

3) Tavius you are a anti-religionist. You spout a good line but know NOTHING. If 1% of Christians think Israel owning the west bank will bring the Armageddon then I will be surprised to say the least. Satan has not been banished yet, and the thousand years of peace has not occurred. Learn a religion in full or be accused of being an idiot in full again before you go spouting off.

4) The issue wont be resolved until the Palestine's either quit on their own, or quit receiving support from the West. I mean political support, propaganda support, and the likes. Think on this, if those finely crafted rockets they fire had been made into machining materials, and the machines which made the rockets was used to make more machines, Palestine would be RICHER than Israel. But all you Euro and other anti-Israeli trash cant think about that.

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Re: Israel & Hezbollah rockets

Einstein... as always your views on this is weird. Palestinia is occupied. Israel is occupying it. If they stop occupying it there would be no needfor violence. Instead you want them to stop getting the worlds atention and the support of their own people by doing whatever little they can to fight back and be ... well in 50 years there wont be much of a palestinia if this keeps going on.

The democratic Israel needs to make a peace with the palestinians and get the heck away from their land to resolve this. Also, in Tibet its freedomfighters, here it is terrorists. And they do more or less the same thing.

25 Inventors: Back from Hell (8528) (x:93,y:21) 391 845454 - Dont see them coming back up. Theyre out of the game. Pretender, will finish out of top 30.
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Re: Israel & Hezbollah rockets

oh boy......not this topic again.


the Jews in Israel will live w/Palestinians.

The Palestinians want to drive the Jews into the sea.



Its that simple.  One will compromise, the other wants total dominion.

Come .......joust w/the master.
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Re: Israel & Hezbollah rockets

"1) Displacing that much DPS would pretty much negate 2/3 of the populated Palestine lands and 1/3 of the Israeli lands"

So?  They'll be cramped but they can just take Japan's advice and build up.  Worst case scenario plague breaks out and they all die in which case the issue is resolved.

"2) Seeking out the guilty parties is impossible while Palestinians will hide the terrorists. Act this out in your own city. Goto the far side of your city, act as if you fired a rocket, and find a place 1 mile away in less than 15 minutes. Figure how many places are available for you to hide at."

Fair enough I'm sure the Brits had the same problem during the American Revolution.  Keep in mind that in the mindss of the Palestinians Israel is the bad guy.

There are 10 kinds of people in this world, those who understand binary and those who don't.