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Topic: Monopoly

I think one of the major problems of tomorows economy will be the forming of monopolies. There are rules and institutions in the western world to prevent this, and they do work, but some compagnies seem to find a hole. After all, it is very difficult to make good laws for this particular issue. Considering the amount of money involved, the risk for corruption is rather high.

Personally I don't see a simple answere to this problem. But it is a real threat.

There is one exception were you create a problem with a simple sollution. Sometimes when big gov institutions got privatised, they have a large chance of having a monopoly in a certain market. In this particular case, they can split it up and make sure it gets devided between enough different parties. For most other cases though, its far more difficult.

Please don't turn this into a tax debate unless it really has to do with it. There are enough other threads about that.

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Re: Monopoly

If anyone doubt that Monopolies will cause a problem in the future I suggest they look at Russia now.

"So, it's defeat for you, is it? Someday I must meet a similar fate..."

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3 Reply by ☭ Fokker (edited by ☭ Fokker 25-Mar-2008 19:02:22)

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Re: Monopoly

I thought we were discussing monopolies and their effects on business. My bad.

"So, it's defeat for you, is it? Someday I must meet a similar fate..."

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Re: Monopoly

@Zarf

You could say that microsoft is sort of a monopoly since it controls most of the market but it isn't a true monopoly

"Whoever said the pen is mightier than the sword obviously never encountered
automatic weapons."-General Douglas MacArthur
"Cluster bombing from B-52s are very, very, accurate. The bombs are guaranteed
to always hit the ground."-USAF Ammo Troop

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Re: Monopoly

i like monopoly, it's a fun game

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Re: Monopoly

"How about some example companies, or some examples of what "holes" we're talking about?"
As PVP pointed out, microsoft is a nice example. They have to pay large amounts of fee to all kind of businesses and institutions each year but it is still profitable because their monopoly is very effective.

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Re: Monopoly

They recently had to pay 750mil to the EU because they wouldn't open up more of their source code. More and higher sanctions will follow if they dont comply.

But Belgacom here in Belgium is also largly state run and they don't wanna open up their network so other providers can offer better deals.

Not many people know this, but I own the first radio in Springfield. Not much on the air then, just Edison reciting the alphabet over and over. "A" he'd say; then "B." "C" would usually follow...

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Re: Monopoly

holes were in? how about the national debt, where the lenders are sitting making unbelievable interest off their loans since we never reduce the principal. there's some fat cows feeding off the masses

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Re: Monopoly

governments are another example of monopolies only one government per country...

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Re: Monopoly

Microsoft shouldn't be forced to open it's source code.  How is that fair practice?  They worked for years on it and now should give it away?  I agree with making them not able to bundle "excessive" software with the OS but how is giving away the source code competitive?

Apple pretty much focrces people to upgrade every year or so or their machines are no longer compatable with the latest software where is the EU on that issue?

I'm going to be nicer promise

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Re: Monopoly

"Microsoft shouldn't be forced to open it's source code.  How is that fair practice?  They worked for years on it and now should give it away?  I agree with making them not able to bundle "excessive" software with the OS but how is giving away the source code competitive?

Apple pretty much focrces people to upgrade every year or so or their machines are no longer compatable with the latest software where is the EU on that issue?"

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~ ☭ Fokker

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Re: Monopoly

probably the difference is that apple doesn't occupy a "dominant" market presence in the EU. The EU antitrust powers regarding monopolies are  only aimed at entities with such a dominant presence.

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Re: Monopoly

I agree monopolies generally aren't a good thing but if a company like Microsoft is able to become a monopoly simply because no one can, or is willing to, compete with them should they really be penalized for it.  If I make lemonade that is better than anyone elses and because I get more customers other lemonade makers go out of business or I buy them, in a free market should I be penalized because my product is superior.  If so then what motivation do I have to be innovative with it.

There are 10 kinds of people in this world, those who understand binary and those who don't.

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Re: Monopoly

microsoft is a terrible example

please note the failure of vista and how little impact its introduction had on the market

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Re: Monopoly

vista isnt a failure, its a work in progress and is the way of the future.

the only problem i have with microsoft is so many things requiring microsoft; if other companies would make OSs that would be just as compatible as windows for every piece of software made for windows, i'd have no problem with microsoft's practices.

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Re: Monopoly

@Q

Yes that is competitive, because other companies using the source code might give better deals than microsoft, in turn forcing microsoft to offer better deals. It's good for the consumer and competition.

If you ask me patents on inventions should also last for only a couple of years. If any company can make anything and better than the inventor, thats good competition for me.

"Whoever said the pen is mightier than the sword obviously never encountered
automatic weapons."-General Douglas MacArthur
"Cluster bombing from B-52s are very, very, accurate. The bombs are guaranteed
to always hit the ground."-USAF Ammo Troop

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Re: Monopoly

... It's not competitive, it's removing any advantage Microsoft had for ITS hard work.  This issue at hand isn't as it was in the 90's with Microsoft bundeling software to remove competition ability to compete with free.  The genuiningly deserve their market position as people have "free" Linux and overpriced but yet nice MacOS to choose from.  Macs are approaching 10% of the global market.  Kinda significant.

Patents I believe "only" last for 25 years.  Microsoft's position isn't because of pattents.  And we are ignoring the issue of security handing out the source allows everyone to find holes in the OS as a clear understanding of how everything works will only make voulnerabilities even more obvious.  And you'd be destroying that company.  Everyone would essentially be able to use Windows for free.  That's 40% of the companies revenue.  Some companies have been able to outcompete Microsoft and others should endevor to do such.  Laziness should not be rewarded.  Microsoft unfairly bundeling or locking out third party software should not be tollerated.  But competition is competition if they are better well they just are deal with it.  Provided they are FAIRLY competing why should they be punished for being good?  What's next Google must open it's source?  Then WOW?  Because they obviously have some crack in their software that other game companies need so they can compete.

The only real reason to do such drastic action is if the barriers for entry is high.  There are FREE tools to write your own software and that's one of the reason Linux exists and is somewhat succesful.  Heck I'm typing this on a Linux machine.  Other than they are big and succesful what is your reason for opening the source code?  I was in support of the penalty for pretty much destroying Netscape.  I personally suffered from the removal of Office as I didn't buy my computer until after but understood the position.  What is the JUSTIFICATION for opening their own hard worked source code?

Google came up out of nowhere and they are kicking MSN search.  If there truely is a better product out there then people will use it.

I'm going to be nicer promise

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Re: Monopoly

"Everyone would essentially be able to use Windows for free."

Sounds good to me. Besides, videogames and computer software is way overpriced. Thats why there is so much piracy. If a software company would lower prices it would get more income in the long run and it would also be good for the consumer.

"Whoever said the pen is mightier than the sword obviously never encountered
automatic weapons."-General Douglas MacArthur
"Cluster bombing from B-52s are very, very, accurate. The bombs are guaranteed
to always hit the ground."-USAF Ammo Troop

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19 Reply by avogadro (edited by Gwynedd 19-Jun-2008 02:06:50)

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Re: Monopoly

videogames are not overpriced and software companies are getting [tree]ed. making games as graphic intensive as they currently are is extremely expensive; you're seeing video game brands that used to be on a single console trying to make their games compatible with all 3 consoles to make up for the dramatic increase in the cost of making video games, but thats a very labor intensive process.

piracy is common because the work to design a game is way more expensive then copying the game from one cd to another cd...

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Re: Monopoly

paul, is music expensive?  99cents?  Isn't there also music piracy?  As avo said nope piracy exists because of the ease of doing it.  So glad you acknowledged your premise, company profits are bad, free stuff for you is good.  Without an incentive for being inventive things will stagnate.  Companies need to WANT to make profit.

I'm going to be nicer promise

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Re: Monopoly

okok:)

I'm just messing with you.

I actually know very little about technology. I don't even know what a source code is.

But still I think video games are over-priced. For example "WOW" guild wars can do it without monthly payment, Why can't they?!?

Also I love piracy as long as nobody else does it but me cus' that would mean less profits for companies.

really I want to know

"Whoever said the pen is mightier than the sword obviously never encountered
automatic weapons."-General Douglas MacArthur
"Cluster bombing from B-52s are very, very, accurate. The bombs are guaranteed
to always hit the ground."-USAF Ammo Troop

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Re: Monopoly

better graphics = more expensive. and for any mmo to be without monthly payments, has to be at least advertisment to pay for the bills. in wow you get better graphics, better customer service, and new content.

theres a reason why theres 10 million people playing wow and not guild wars.

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Re: Monopoly

yeah their addicted...

My neighbour playes 8 hours of wow a day becaus he says he doesn't wanna waste the time he has bought.

GW has better graphics than WOW

"Whoever said the pen is mightier than the sword obviously never encountered
automatic weapons."-General Douglas MacArthur
"Cluster bombing from B-52s are very, very, accurate. The bombs are guaranteed
to always hit the ground."-USAF Ammo Troop

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Re: Monopoly

zarf, perhaps not as related as first cousins, but i think it's relevant, considering its unhealthy and oligarchic nature. sure, they're not selling a market, but the national debt is 'cornered' in so far as it is stagnant, and the lenders are growing fat off tax dollars, and i wouldn't be surprised if the line the wallets of the powers that be to keep things that way.

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Re: Monopoly

paul,
WoW makes more money than Guild wars:D.  BTW Guildwars sold over 4 maybe even 5 million copies.  I've played some of both.  Guildwars is alot more compact and the instances are smaller so can be ran on cheaper machines.  I am glad that they tried it and were succesful as I love multiplayer games but hate constantly paying.  That and WoW has "free" expansions while Guildwars you pay per expansion.  I know there is The Burning Crusade and the other one coming out but before this there were what 12 major "events" within WoW?  But we getting off topic.

Are there any good reasons to have a monopoly?

I'm going to be nicer promise

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