> coffeeking wrote:

> now fokker, i will not pretend to know anything about satanism to any degree.

however, i know for a fact that traditional baptismal vows include "i reject satan"

i dare say there is a conflict somewhere<

Lesson number one:

Satanists do not believe in a literal Satan/Devil.

Those are Devil Worshippers, not Satanists.

so, out of my own curiousity, what do satanists believe?

It's hard to say without going into exessive, and boring, detail.
Here's a good starting point:

The Rules:
http://www.churchofsatan.com/Pages/Eleven.html

The Statements
http://www.churchofsatan.com/Pages/NineStatements.html

The Sins:
http://www.churchofsatan.com/Pages/Sins.html

Judaism - 6
Buddhism - 21
Hinduism - 12
Sikhism - 10
Taoism - 21
Shinto - 9
Bah

> avogadro wrote:

> fokker, i think you misread my last post, which is probably mostly my fault. if satanists cant beleive in a literal devil, then every religion where there is a beleif in a literal devil wouldnt be able to become satanist along with that religion. 

for example, many christian religions beleive in a literal devil; if satanists dont beleive in a literal devil, a satanist couldnt be that christian religion. but if the religion of satanism doesnt beleive in a literal devil, but the lack of a devil isnt a dogma that satanists must beleive, then the religions would be compatible.<

With you now
Although I have heard of people who are half and half (never met one personally) all of the Satanists I have met seem to hold the belief that in order to be a true Satanist one must absolutely not believe in a Devil.
Tomayto Tomahto I guess.

Judaism - 6
Buddhism - 21
Hinduism - 12
Sikhism - 10
Taoism - 21
Shinto - 9
Bah

Someone ought to do a P vs C on these religions:

Taoism - 21
Good strong religion, strong dogma and been dominating this round. Only religion that can pose a threat is their ally Buddhism. Contender!

Satanism - 10
Had a decent start, seemed to be going places but made too many enemies. Looks like it will be curtains soon for Beelzebub's buddies. Definitely pretenders

Anyone? I'm lazy!

"But now comes your mistake. You argue that the only thing in common for atheists is the belief in the non-existance of god and that therefore they are not religious. To me it seems like they are religious, although only on a very low level (the level where you agree with that one "rule"/statement) so they DEFINATELY dont belong to non-religious. If you're not non-religious (absence of religious beliefs), you must be religious (existance of any amount of religious belief)."

well, there would be two different ways i could take this argument if we were in the politics forum. 1. i could debate the meaning of the word religious and whether a simple belief in a lack of God would be enough to qualify someone as religious and how people in todays' world and the known imperfectness of our senses make leaps of faith in life no matter their religion on topics other then religion and that simply believing or not believing in a God is no more religious then believing theirs really a monitor infront of you; or i could point out how the non-religious group is such a minority that their view of religious and atheism doesnt matter because the vast majority would view atheism as non-religious when comparing it to themselves and simply because you are at the extremes of a comparison, doesnt change other faith's place in the comparison.

"
unfortunately, your claim that the majority say atheism is not religious is not true. proven in its simplest form by the fact that you are the only one saying so."

in a comparison to people of all religions, atheists are on the non-religious fringe, so are non-religious.

"
atheism is based upon BELIEFS and not facts, therefore a religion. argument OVER"

that was never the argument. atheism is a religion, and guess what, agnostics are part of a religion too.

oh and i love run on sentences, periods are Nazis

Judaism - 6
Buddhism - 21
Hinduism - 12
Sikhism - 11
Taoism - 21
Shinto - 9
Bah

Judaism - 7
Buddhism - 21
Hinduism - 12
Sikhism - 11
Taoism - 21
Shinto - 9
Bah