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Re: Elimination: Religious Groups (& Atheism)

God, you're daft. Religion doesn't mean "oh, I have to worship a god and go to church!".


"A religion is a set of beliefs and practices often organized around supernatural and moral claims, and often codified as prayer, ritual, and religious law. Religion also encompasses ancestral or cultural traditions, writings, history, and mythology, as well as personal faith and mystic experience. The term "religion" refers to both the personal practices related to communal faith and to group rituals and communication stemming from shared conviction."

There you go. Note the *often* which doesn't exclude other ways of believing and being religious. So suffice to say atheism belongs under the term religion as much as any other.

I'll never know if it was worth the pain, but I still loved it more than anything in the world - it was my life.

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302 Reply by avogadro (edited by avogadro 25-Mar-2008 16:07:22)

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Re: Elimination: Religious Groups (& Atheism)

"There you go. Note the *often* which doesn't exclude other ways of believing and being religious. So suffice to say atheism belongs under the term religion as much as any other."

i agree with that and never claimed otherwise. I am simply saying that Athiesm can be and often is lumped into a group of religions just like a catholics or baptists can be lumped into Christianity.

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Re: Elimination: Religious Groups (& Atheism)

How does that fit into you using the word non-religious? Which was my first point tongue

I'll never know if it was worth the pain, but I still loved it more than anything in the world - it was my life.

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304 Reply by avogadro (edited by avogadro 25-Mar-2008 16:33:30)

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Re: Elimination: Religious Groups (& Atheism)

non-religious is the only term i know of that describes that group of religions that atheism belongs to. its called non-religious because the religions in it arent religious in that they dont have moral codes defined by the religion that they strive to live by. 

i am not saying to be religious you have to believe in a God. My understanding of Buddhism is that they dont beleive in a God, but that they strive for inner peace. So they have moral codes to help people obtain inner peace. Busshists can be religious.

there is no moral codes of atheism, there is no ultimate goal of atheism; people cant devote their lives to being a good atheist because there is no goal of atheism just like agnostics, people that dont believe in any God, or other non-religious religions.

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Re: Elimination: Religious Groups (& Atheism)

Judaism - 7
Buddhism - 20
Hinduism - 12
Sikhism - 10
Taoism - 19
Shinto - 8
Bah

Yes, you're special. Just like everyone else.

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Re: Elimination: Religious Groups (& Atheism)

FURTHERMORE, atheists gather together to discuss their beliefs and actively recruit people to their cause. Please note the north american Atheist conference as proof to that.

and to make it clear, Agnostics (such as myself) state that it is impossible to know about any greater being or deity and therefore are more commonly termed as skeptics. and extremes could be call nihilists

Judaism - 7
Buddhism - 20
Hinduism - 12
Sikhism - 10
Taoism - 20
Shinto - 8
Bah

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Re: Elimination: Religious Groups (& Atheism)

> avogadro wrote:

"there is no moral codes of atheism, there is no ultimate goal of atheism; people cant devote their lives to being a good atheist because there is no goal of atheism just like agnostics, people that dont believe in any God, or other non-religious religions."


benig a good atheist? maybe they focus on being "good" ppl/humans? or smt else?
mebbe they go on about common sense?
mebbe it differs from person to person?

what you are saying is oftend interpreted as atheists being a-moral, and worse..

till the end of time..

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Re: Elimination: Religious Groups (& Atheism)

Judaism - 6
Buddhism - 20
Hinduism - 12
Sikhism - 10
Taoism - 20
Shinto - 9
Bah

"Whoever said the pen is mightier than the sword obviously never encountered
automatic weapons."-General Douglas MacArthur
"Cluster bombing from B-52s are very, very, accurate. The bombs are guaranteed
to always hit the ground."-USAF Ammo Troop

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Re: Elimination: Religious Groups (& Atheism)

Judaism - 5
Buddhism - 20
Hinduism - 12
Sikhism - 10
Taoism - 20
Shinto - 9
Bah

For the time will soon come when Gnomes will shape the fortunes of all...

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Re: Elimination: Religious Groups (& Atheism)

Judaism - 6
Buddhism - 19
Hinduism - 12
Sikhism - 10
Taoism - 20
Shinto - 9
Bah

[color=pink]*♥

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Re: Elimination: Religious Groups (& Atheism)

Judaism - 6
Buddhism - 19
Hinduism - 12
Sikhism - 10
Taoism - 21
Shinto - 9
Bah

[i]Tommy gun

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Re: Elimination: Religious Groups (& Atheism)

"Look at all you self-proclaimed atheists, willingly voting satanism as soon as atheism is gone. You're pathetic."

Satanism is just Atheism with a sense of humour and drama, or are you confusing Satanism with Devil Worship?
IF anything was pathetic it was the timed attack against Atheism, but with discretion being the better part of valour I decided to simply sit back and smile. Besides, it's no different to all the Christians voting Buddist.

Judaism - 6
Buddhism - 19
Hinduism - 12
Sikhism - 10
Taoism - 21
Shinto - 9
Bah

"So, it's defeat for you, is it? Someday I must meet a similar fate..."

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Re: Elimination: Religious Groups (& Atheism)

> ..Nemeara.. wrote:

> > avogadro wrote:

"there is no moral codes of atheism, there is no ultimate goal of atheism; people cant devote their lives to being a good atheist because there is no goal of atheism just like agnostics, people that dont believe in any God, or other non-religious religions."


benig a good atheist? maybe they focus on being "good" ppl/humans? or smt else?
mebbe they go on about common sense?
mebbe it differs from person to person?

what you are saying is oftend interpreted as atheists being a-moral, and worse..

yes, atheists can strive to be good humans, but atheism doesnt define what being a good human is.

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Re: Elimination: Religious Groups (& Atheism)

I know very well the difference between Satanism and Devil Worship, thank you very much. I disagree with "Satanism is just Atheism with a sense of humour and drama". It makes you sound like you don't really have a clue and just think of religion as a joke, in my opinion. Think twice and then explain to me why you consider Satanism like you described it. Maybe it'll make me laugh, although it'll probably make me cry.

I'll never know if it was worth the pain, but I still loved it more than anything in the world - it was my life.

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315 Reply by avogadro (edited by [RPA] Lloyd List 25-Mar-2008 20:08:48)

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Re: Elimination: Religious Groups (& Atheism)

"Non-religious is agnosticism. Saying I dont know. Atheist believe that there is no god. Thats the definition of the word atheist. Its as much a religion (a set of beliefs) as any other religion in the world. They have faith in what they see and touch is real and that there is indeed no god. They got no proof of that so its "only" faith/belief. Nothing more. That makes atheist religious."

ok, im starting to loose my patience. Religious is a [] adjective, learn [] simple english if you want to debate on an english speaking forum. religion does not equal religious. there isnt a certain degree of religion; something is either a religion or it isnt; people however can allow their religion to consume different amounts of their life; religious describes people, not religions. atheists have one basic common beleif that is there is no God, it demands nothing from its followers; so its followers dont base anything off the lessons of their religion, because there are no lessons, so they arent religious, same thing with agnostic people or people claiming to be a part of no religions, all these people combined make up the group of religion, non-religious. its not [] complex.

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Re: Elimination: Religious Groups (& Atheism)

Judaism - 6
Buddhism - 20
Hinduism - 12
Sikhism - 10
Taoism - 21
Shinto - 9
Bah

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317 Reply by ☭ Fokker (edited by ☭ Fokker 25-Mar-2008 19:49:05)

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Re: Elimination: Religious Groups (& Atheism)

"Think twice and then explain to me why you consider Satanism like you described it."

1) I have read all of Anton LaVey's books pertaining to Satanism.
2) That is how Anton LaVey himself decribes Satanism.
3) Upon reading any of his work it becomes apparent very quickly that Satanism is not meant to be taken as literally as some christians take it.
4) Chapter for turning into a werewolf?
5) Chapter on how to perform a convincing Satanic ceremony for the benefit of your Christian visitors?
6) How to keep a straight face when performing the ceremony?

EDIT:

Besides, it's more fun than voting for Buddism, some forms of which are quite Atheist themselves.

"So, it's defeat for you, is it? Someday I must meet a similar fate..."

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318 Reply by avogadro (edited by avogadro 25-Mar-2008 19:57:18)

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Re: Elimination: Religious Groups (& Atheism)

LaVey has stated that his religion was

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Re: Elimination: Religious Groups (& Atheism)

Just like with Buddism... wasn't Rand the Objectivist? The "Your mind is your world" woman?

"So, it's defeat for you, is it? Someday I must meet a similar fate..."

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Re: Elimination: Religious Groups (& Atheism)

avogadro, you seem to be a very confused young man.

these are all forms of religious thinking here, and as such each is different for very specific reasons. you simply cannot be more than one.

now, there are 3 others forms of thought, philosophical, historical, and skeptical. you can be combinations of beliefs under these, but you certainly cannot be both satanist and christian. there are conflicts of dogma

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Re: Elimination: Religious Groups (& Atheism)

There is no conflict of dogma as there is no dogma is Satanism per se.

"So, it's defeat for you, is it? Someday I must meet a similar fate..."

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Re: Elimination: Religious Groups (& Atheism)

Fokker, LaVey's Satanism isn't the only form of Satanism, so mind your words.
Avogadro, calm down and stop thinking we're all stupid because we disagree.

I'll never know if it was worth the pain, but I still loved it more than anything in the world - it was my life.

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Re: Elimination: Religious Groups (& Atheism)

im not confused at all, even though, admitedly, my understanding of satanism and its dogma is limited and because of that i cant be certain with which religions it conflicts with.

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Re: Elimination: Religious Groups (& Atheism)

now fokker, i will not pretend to know anything about satanism to any degree.

however, i know for a fact that traditional baptismal vows include "i reject satan"

i dare say there is a conflict somewhere

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Re: Elimination: Religious Groups (& Atheism)

"Avogadro, calm down and stop thinking we're all stupid because we disagree."

i dont think people are stupid because they disagree i think they're stupid because i've clarified how religion and religious are not indentical multiple times and still people dont understand such a basic concept.

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