oh, and prove this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flying_Spaghetti_Monster is less correct then any other creationist theory

Owned mayhaps

please demonstrate how trial and error produced the potassium osmosis function in cells and I'll accept the theory of spontaneous life

and you say science should be able to answer everything? We can't BELIEVE in something like spirit?

> Red_Rooster wrote:
> and you say science should be able to answer everything? <

No, and no good scientist would ever say that either, because the nature and circumstances of our existence may well prevent us from discovering the answers to all of the questions no matter how long we keep looking, but the key point here is: We can accept that, you can't.

Or are you referring to stupid "questions of morality" like "If there is no God then why do people do nice things?" because you cannot handle the concept of enlightened self-interest without seeing it as something totally selfish?

>We can't BELIEVE in something like spirit?<

We cannot believe in the Spaghetti Monster, the Dancing Beaver, or the Almighty Whirling Ball of Death, nor can we believe that we are just smart animals, nor can we believe that a "Holy Spirit" can exist in a universe that it did not create, let alone believe that it develop an interest in a world it did not create, so no, no you can't believe in something like spirit.

> The Yell wrote:

> please demonstrate how trial an' error produced th' potassium osmosis function in cells an' I'll accept th' theory o' spontaneous life<

Trial an' error is somethin' that can only be attempted by a livin', thinkin', bein' an' not a universe/dimension/plane o' existence, an' therefore any failure at attemptin' t' explain how potassium osmosis could occur by trial an' error has no bearin' on th' theory o' spontaneous life, but doies infact have some bearin' on th' theory o' intelligent bounty an'/or divine creation.

I thoughtn I addressed the post quite well, but if there is something I missed then please feel free to publicly enlighten me.

If you take a watch and smash it and place it in a bag with some firecrackers.  will the watch come out fixed.

If you want to fix the watch you take it to the watchmaker.

If you have broken shoe do you smash it with a good shoe and the broken shoe is fixed

you have to take the broken shoe to a shoemaker

If you look around you will see the proof you seek. How perfect is the earth tilted and the distance from the Sun any farther away we would freeze and closer we would burn. You look at the universe you see. If you look at this world you also see.

If you look at how complex the human body is and how everyfuntion of it can not funtion on its own ,but depends on another. You know a designer had to be involved.

If you take paints and throw them on a canvas will the mona lisa appear. No! you need an artist that knows how to paint the mona lisa.

I hope this helps

Good point Kemp. I personally think that the world was created for human life for us to achieve as near perfection as possible.

Not necessarily that the world was created perfectly for human life. That said, there're many parameters that exist, not just tempertaure range, that allows us to exist. Eg: water content, (arising from tempterature,) volume of gasses, distance from the sun and the weight of the earth and moon causing this, (linked to temperature.)

Or the earth has existed like is has for millions of years and something put us here, or we evolved from something that hitched a ride on something that hit earth.
Or we are the ultimate evolution of ourselves.. unless in millions of years we have evolved larger heads encompassing larger brain mass and superior intellect, possibly even a million years closer to Cosmic Consciousness,  larger eyes to cope with the darkness which surrounds the earth through years of decay following numerous catastrophic Ice and Heat Ages and resulting pollution, smaller mouths because verbal communication wouldn't be as effective or practical in the situations we now live in. Maybe a smaller stature because there would be less of us and the hunter gatherer violent streak would have evolved into such a miniscule  repressed characteristic,  hence no violence.
I.e - A common perception of an 'Alien'

Or even..
Maybe Animals are more evolved than us and has found ways to adapt to the environment without destroying it beyond repair, even evolved to have lower sex drives to produce less offspring to destroy the environment, (even producing more in some case to contradict to natural predators continuous hunger for such delights). And us, an ultimately imperfect  evolutionary species just come and destroy it and them and most of ourselves.

I've always been curious to know what Christian folk imagine whats going to happen after The Rapture?
Maybe the followers JUST LEAVE allowing all those left behind to LIVE WITHOUT THEM. (if that theory is true..)

> Jets wrote:

> If you take a watch and smash it and place it in a bag with some firecrackers.  will the watch come out fixed.

If you do it for billions of years, and a billion times per second, then yes, there's a chance it will come out fixed once.  It's a matter of time, and chance.

"If you look around you will see the proof you seek. How perfect is the earth tilted and the distance from the Sun any farther away we would freeze and closer we would burn. You look at the universe you see. If you look at this world you also see."
--> this planet just happens to have the right conditions for life, yes, else we wouldn't be here having this discussion.  There are more planets in our universe than sand grains on the earth, chances are at least one of them has all the right conditions

"If you look at how complex the human body is and how everyfuntion of it can not funtion on its own ,but depends on another. You know a designer had to be involved."

--> this is quite well explained by the evolution theory, read it.

"If you take paints and throw them on a canvas will the mona lisa appear. No! you need an artist that knows how to paint the mona lisa. "
--> again a matter of time and chance.

"I hope this helps"

I hope this helps too

I am a creationist but not a Young Earth Creationist. I believe in BioLogos. BioLogos, more commonly reffered to as theistic evolution, acknowledges evolution, the universe as 14 billion years old and all that other stuff. As a Catholic I feel it is a belief that demonstrates science and faith at harmony together. If God is outside of the universe it raises the interesting question if, as C.S. Lewis suggested, could he simultaneously see into the past,present and future? If so then he could have easily planned ahead to ensure that after he started off the creation of the universe it would eventually have evolved into what it is now.

Take it for what it is. It's just my opinion