Topic: European language

Should we have a unified European language or better keep it the way it is? Should it be english,french,german, spanish or an artificial made language?

I'm in favor of having one second language in common everywhere. The troubles I see however are:
*the germanic/romanic language difficulties. Eg, english will be more difficult for spanish, italians or french people.
*some people will always disagree, whatever the option.
*some nations learn a second language at school standard and then often later on a third. This is different for different nations
Then you have an artificial one as otion:
*some people will always disagree, whatever the result.
*it won't fit for all languages the same.
*it need to be created.
*it need to get of the ground really good or it will die out.

Still its in my mind as a good thing.
Comments?

Re: European language

isn't english pretty much that?

NEE NAW NEE NAW

Primo

Re: European language

but english is one of the most difficult languages to learn, it's up there with german.
http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn1233-english-is-toughest-european-language-to-read.html

"So, it's defeat for you, is it? Someday I must meet a similar fate..."

4 (edited by Psychogenesis 13-Mar-2008 15:47:27)

Re: European language

Its also more versatile due to the amount of misuses of it smile Theres so many common mistakes that ppl make when using English, that you often don't need to use it too accurately for other people to understand you - look at the american/british english differences for example.

Psychogenesis / Baracus / Coco


Thus, he proclaimed "By the power vested in me, I now declare you the 12th Earl of Toolchester, and what a tool you shall be"

Re: European language

English would probably be best, although Esperanto was created as a language pretty much everyone in the world should be able to learn.

"When we hang the capitalists they will sell us the rope." - Joseph Stalin
Lemming of Disappearance and

Re: European language

english is it....

as for the difficulty in learning it; the english and americans have no problem; if some countries are having a hard time teaching its population it, they just need to start earlier smile

Re: European language

there is only space for one motherlanguage in your brain. At least, that was what I always heared. Is there a new theory?

In any case you can't compare it to a second language avo.

Re: European language

seems like most people here don't have problems with english, but we should ask ourself how many posters come from france and ask why.

Re: European language

esperanto? tongue

Re: European language

Esperanto - mid-20th century (I think), language devised to incorporate most abilities of current world languages, but in an easy and simple system.
My grandfather used to use Esperanto to correspond with people in the USSR

Psychogenesis / Baracus / Coco


Thus, he proclaimed "By the power vested in me, I now declare you the 12th Earl of Toolchester, and what a tool you shall be"

Re: European language

lol i know what esperanto is, i thought of it as an most obvious choice... smile

Re: European language

learn chinese and eat rice X(

i love you all!

Re: European language

But if we use esperanto, it needs a second version i.m.o. It can be made even more easy. Then again I'm not an expert in esperanto, I can hardly communicate in it.

Another option is to use a simplified version of english for foreigners. Adjusting a few rules would surely make it a whole lot easier. Tough this will create a lto of resistance.

Re: European language

Everybody in my class can comunicate in english. It's actually very easy to learn right now because most of the internet is in english and tv shows are in english. It's easier for people from small countries to learn it because in germany for example all the english shows have been dubbed over.

"Whoever said the pen is mightier than the sword obviously never encountered
automatic weapons."-General Douglas MacArthur
"Cluster bombing from B-52s are very, very, accurate. The bombs are guaranteed
to always hit the ground."-USAF Ammo Troop

Re: European language

But yeah the only problem with english is spelling and pronaunciation because words aren't pronounced to the letter.

"Whoever said the pen is mightier than the sword obviously never encountered
automatic weapons."-General Douglas MacArthur
"Cluster bombing from B-52s are very, very, accurate. The bombs are guaranteed
to always hit the ground."-USAF Ammo Troop

Re: European language

well i dont think it should be a problem , as long as ppl stick to some standard english, and not slang or dialect, or talk with a very very very heavy accent big_smile  ( *is reminded of me french teacher, she could make english sound french, to the point you d have trouble recognising it as english tongue)

till the end of time..

Re: European language

There is a reason why Esperanto isn't a world language yet tongue
The fact that it's artificial plays a surprisingly big role in it for one wink
Also, there's no reason to learn a completely new language when history has brought us to the point where English fulfills the role of world language pretty well. As such, on a smaller scale (Europe) it's only easier cause you have less different countries to keep in mind *and* you have the English living at your doorstep tongue

So no discussion needed as to what language...

I'll never know if it was worth the pain, but I still loved it more than anything in the world - it was my life.

Re: European language

> avogadro wrote:

> english is it....

as for the difficulty in learning it; the english and americans have no problem; if some countries are having a hard time teaching its population it, they just need to start earlier smile<

I takes english speaking children 2.5 years to reach the same level of understanding as non english speaking children reach after 1 year.
Sorry Avo, I don't like it either, but English really is a bad language.

"So, it's defeat for you, is it? Someday I must meet a similar fate..."

Re: European language

I haven't been given an education in English that I consider decent until I got at uni...
You don't see me having trouble with it though. And since I'm by no means super-intelligent, it's just shows people need to put some effort into it and they'll grasp the language soon enough wink
This requires people to care about their linguistic skills, of course..

I'll never know if it was worth the pain, but I still loved it more than anything in the world - it was my life.

Re: European language

Esperanto didn't take off because it employs a lot of idioms and constructions of English.  It isn't a self-contained language, and I don't know if it will be.

I vote for Klingon, or the Quenya of the LOTR films

The core joke of Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy is that of course no civilization would develop personal computers with instant remote database recovery, and then waste this technology to find good drinks.
Steve Jobs has ruined this joke.

21 (edited by East 14-Mar-2008 22:38:56)

Re: European language

Only an englishman could have the arrogance to think his language was hard to learn; of the languages I know english has got to be the easiest one by far (including my native language), it's ridiculous how easy it is. sure you'll make a few spelling mistakes and quirky sentences but that's even normal for native speakers in any language

german is exponentially harder than english to get a decent handle on

PS ever consider that study shows british children have bad education?

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Re: European language

The hardest european languages to learn actualy are Finnish, Estonian and Hungarian which are all Finno-ugric languages.

For example Estonian nouns and adjectives decline in 14 cases(english has 2 and german 4):nominative, genitive, partitive, illative, inessive, elative, allative, adessive, ablative, translative, terminative, essive, abessive, and comitative.

This means that we don't have things like: of,has,for infront of words but the whole structure of the word changes with some words changing totaly irregularly.

Finnish has 15 cases but all the changes follow a pattern and hungarian has 18 cases.

"Whoever said the pen is mightier than the sword obviously never encountered
automatic weapons."-General Douglas MacArthur
"Cluster bombing from B-52s are very, very, accurate. The bombs are guaranteed
to always hit the ground."-USAF Ammo Troop

Re: European language

Surely it would make good longterm economic sense for most small EU countries to change their official language to English anyway? There'd be resistance by many... but there's really no room for Dutch/Flemish, Slovakian, Hungarian, Polish, Danish, Swedish or Finnish in the world. I woud also argue that German and Italian are pointless as international languages. Only French and Spanish speakers in the EU have a case for keeping their language (but should still learn English as their 2nd language).

Is English hard? I don't know. It's my tongue and I speak no other. I'd say that if English is "around" people (TV, music,ads) all the time then it gets absorbed. Throw in formal teaching from an early age and there's no reason it should be particularly hard.

To put into perspective, China and Korea are launching massive English teaching programmes. India is used by so many American and UK firms because it has English as a national language.

I think why we keep languages is a matter of heritage, politics and culture.
In any event ENGLISH is the official language of the EU, UN, etc. Yes, some countries (France, Russia etc) may choose not to use English for formal meetings. But everything is published in English.

Re: European language

@mace

Culture is very important. The importance of ones mother tongue is harder to understand in large nations because their language has never bee under threat of going extinct. There are just 1 mil Estonian speakers in the world . My country was under foreign rule from 1210-1918. 700!! years of being occupied by Sweden,Denmark,Poland,Russia, the germans and templar knights.

It's a miracle estonian has survived. It has also been voted as the second most beutiful language in the world after Italian. The sentence that got us that place was "tasa s

"Whoever said the pen is mightier than the sword obviously never encountered
automatic weapons."-General Douglas MacArthur
"Cluster bombing from B-52s are very, very, accurate. The bombs are guaranteed
to always hit the ground."-USAF Ammo Troop

Re: European language

"but there's really no room for Dutch/Flemish, Slovakian, Hungarian, Polish, Danish, Swedish or Finnish in the world."


To protect the pride of my mother tongue (and forgetting the fact I speak the Flemish form of it), Dutch isn't as unimportant in the world as you make it seem tongue It's spoken by more people and in more countries than most people realise..

On another note, I wouldn't go as far as to *change* a country's national language to the chosen unified European language. It'd be a second/third/fourth/... official language, sure, but never touch a language status in a country. They'll lynch you tongue

I'll never know if it was worth the pain, but I still loved it more than anything in the world - it was my life.