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Topic: One man, one handgun, 100 lives saved.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article … paign=1490

Only one man armed with a gun is a tyrant, an armed society is a polite society and one man with a gun can stop a lot of killing.

Today the Royal Marines can stand tall.


One man, one gun, no fear, a sense of duty. He deserves a free pint from any soldier or veteran he meets.


This is an example of what we Conservatives are saying. If the people are allowed weapons then bad men with weapons will not do as much harm. God Rest the souls killed by terrorism and God Bless the marine.

Everything bad in the economy is now Obama's fault. Every job lost, all the debt, all the lost retirement funds. All Obama. Are you happy now? We all get to blame Obama!
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2 Reply by Xian (edited by Xian 02-Oct-2013 00:11:59)

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Re: One man, one handgun, 100 lives saved.

you really think that if everyone would wear a firearm, the world would be safer? I think that's just stupid. check the facts, they prove you wrong. 
It's simple, no guns = none get killed by guns, many guns = many get killed by guns


In the United States, annual deaths resulting from firearms total
2011: 32,163 (yes, that's 88/day!)
= the highest in the western world (only countries like mexico, honduras, el salvador,... do worse)


The estimated total number of guns (both licit and illicit) held by civilians in the United States is 270,000,000 to 310,000,000

Rate of Civilian Firearm Possession per 100 Population
The estimated rate of private gun ownership (both licit and illicit) in the United States is 101.05 firearms per 100 people

In a comparison of the number of privately owned guns in 178 countries, the United States ranked at No. 1

source: http://www.gunpolicy.org/firearms/home

Xian

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Re: One man, one handgun, 100 lives saved.

Take guns away from good men and bad men will rule. Take guns from bothand stabbings, blugeons, and explosive based murders will take their place.

The safest places are the places known to have guns.

Everything bad in the economy is now Obama's fault. Every job lost, all the debt, all the lost retirement funds. All Obama. Are you happy now? We all get to blame Obama!
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Re: One man, one handgun, 100 lives saved.

Is the US still a place where the man with the biggest/most gun(s) rules the country? so not much has changed then since the Spanish conquistadores ?

don't you believe what i've written? or didn't you read it?
The estimated rate of private gun ownership (both licit and illicit) in the United States is 101.05 firearms per 100 people
so you can say that the us is a place 'known to have guns'... So why do so many get killed by gunfire??? and do you really think that 200 guns per 100 plp will save any lives???

Xian

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Re: One man, one handgun, 100 lives saved.

Now check actual ownership levels. most gun owners own multiple guns.

And yes, i do contend more guns would equal more peace and safety. An ex-coworker demonstrates this. an armed robbery attempt where the criminal fired a shot. my coworker fired his next killing the man. he will never carry a gun again, never threaten anyone again. more guns means less successful crime, less sucess in crime means less gun crimes.

Everything bad in the economy is now Obama's fault. Every job lost, all the debt, all the lost retirement funds. All Obama. Are you happy now? We all get to blame Obama!
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6 Reply by The Great Eye (edited by The Great Eye 03-Oct-2013 00:13:21)

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Re: One man, one handgun, 100 lives saved.

Lemme save both of you trouble!


Xian: But more guns means more people can easier access guns and they can shoot people more.
Flint: But then more people to counteract the shooters!


How about we skip the 10 posts bouncing the talking point debates back and forth like a tennis match and go to the meat and potatoes?  Comparative statistics backing each side!  big_smile

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Re: One man, one handgun, 100 lives saved.

http://guns.periscopic.com/?year=2013

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Re: One man, one handgun, 100 lives saved.

In my place:

1. if you ask 100 or 1000 persons about gun probably none of them have gun
2. if you cause someone died, any reason including self defence or even only by accident, you must be sentenced

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Re: One man, one handgun, 100 lives saved.

Wow! 88 people a day? Wtf is up with that? How many do the cops kill out of 88? Good vs Bad? lol big_smile

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Re: One man, one handgun, 100 lives saved.

Xian wrote:

In the United States, annual deaths resulting from firearms total
2011: 32,163 (yes, that's 88/day!)
= the highest in the western world (only countries like mexico, honduras, el salvador,... do worse)

Private ownership of guns is illegal in the three countries you listed as being worse than the US. thus your facts support the idea that if you make guns illegal then only criminals will have guns.

States which allow concealed carry, such as Arizona and Texas, have lower gun crime statistics.

Valour-the courage to do what scares you to death

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Re: One man, one handgun, 100 lives saved.

Yeah but those three countries are part of smugglers alley lol, they probably have more Russian guns than the middle east haha tongue

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Re: One man, one handgun, 100 lives saved.

]PW[ Forever wrote:

Yeah but those three countries are part of smugglers alley lol, they probably have more Russian guns than the middle east haha tongue

very true and everygun is in the hand of a criminal/drug dealer. the civilian pop is defenseless

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13 Reply by Xeno (edited by Xeno 03-Oct-2013 06:43:09)

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Re: One man, one handgun, 100 lives saved.

]PW[ Forever wrote:

Wow! 88 people a day?

Correct me if I am wrong, but I think more American civilians have been killed by gun violence than American military personnel have been killed in military combat.

Maybe it safer to be a soldier on active duty in US military than a civilian?

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Re: One man, one handgun, 100 lives saved.

Haha, I wonder what the odds are? smile

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Re: One man, one handgun, 100 lives saved.

MY example is a Mexican town. They had frequent problems with drug runners, corrupt police, and killings. One day recently they said "enough", seized.  the police chief outright, distributed all the guns he had and set up armed patrols. Violence there has only happened once when a tourist tried to speed through upon seeing the armed civilians and got shot for endangering the public. dont run a checkpoint mmkay?

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Re: One man, one handgun, 100 lives saved.

The Three Amigos? yikes

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Re: One man, one handgun, 100 lives saved.

Einstein wrote:

Now check actual ownership levels. most gun owners own multiple guns.

yes off course. But you must admit that it is a lot for a country not at (civil)war   


Einstein wrote:

And yes, i do contend more guns would equal more peace and safety. An ex-coworker demonstrates this. an armed robbery attempt where the criminal fired a shot. my coworker fired his next killing the man. he will never carry a gun again, never threaten anyone again. more guns means less successful crime, less sucess in crime means less gun crimes.

good, then the US can cut back on judges and courts and stuff since everyone with a gun can be judge and executor.
lucky for your coworker there was no 3 person with a gun who thought that your coworker was starting a gunfight...
the problem is that a not everyone is capable of carrying a gun and these people are a threat to everyone else. Also even perfectly normal people can have a nervous breakdown and if they got easy access to guns, none are safe.

Xian

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Re: One man, one handgun, 100 lives saved.

If the soldiers at the naval yard were armed the man would never have gone there to shoot it up, same with fort hood, same with various school and theatre shootings.

i contend a few thousand more guns in the right locations can save hundreds and thousands of lives, and a few hundred thousand would end almost all gun related crimes.

after all would you hold up a bank if you knew all the tellers were armed?

Everything bad in the economy is now Obama's fault. Every job lost, all the debt, all the lost retirement funds. All Obama. Are you happy now? We all get to blame Obama!
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Re: One man, one handgun, 100 lives saved.

http://imgur.com/FjCmtDA

relevant

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Re: One man, one handgun, 100 lives saved.

Xian wrote:

you really think that if everyone would wear a firearm, the world would be safer? I think that's just stupid. check the facts, they prove you wrong. 
It's simple, no guns = none get killed by guns, many guns = many get killed by guns


Indeed, the US government does very well with policing bans!  That's why marijuana and meth production has decreased so much over the past few years.  They're both illegal, and nobody uses them!

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Re: One man, one handgun, 100 lives saved.

Xeno wrote:

Correct me if I am wrong, but I think more American civilians have been killed by gun violence than American military personnel have been killed in military combat.

Maybe it safer to be a soldier on active duty in US military than a civilian?


Sure, unless we're talking strictly numbers.  If technically more civilians die from gun violence, but say...its 1/1000 where as 1/500 in military service (made up numbers as I don't have time to find the correct ones atm)...then no.  Example, if John has 10,000 bad apples from his orchard, but joe has 300 it seems like John is screwed in comparison.  Only when you add on that John had a total of 1,000,000 apples and Joe had a total of 1,000 do you realize that only 1% of John's crop was effected while Joe lost 30% of his.
However you may want to look into getting a job as a statistician.  #1 priority is taking facts and scewing them to make them seem significant.

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Re: One man, one handgun, 100 lives saved.

Einstein wrote:

after all would you hold up a bank if you knew all the tellers were armed?

I think people who rob a bank do have a screw loose in the first place, so you can't compare them with people who think 'normal'.
But lets say you're a criminal and you want to rob a bank and you know the employees and customers are armed, then you must make sure you take them out immediately and you'll have to use more violence (again more people get killed)
if you're scared to rob a bank cause you think you'll be shot, just rob store.
if all the shopkeepers are armed, just rob a house
if all the civilians were armed, make sure you'll have the bigger gun and armour
and so on...

OR
you can try to create an 'arms free' society so bad people (or good people going crazy) wont have access to guns

Xian

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Re: One man, one handgun, 100 lives saved.

Xian, simple question:

Do you think the United States could feasibly implement a policy of confiscating 300 million guns in the country, and prohibiting the legal and illegal importation of said guns, considering both the sheer number of guns and the Mexican border?

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24 Reply by Xeno (edited by Xeno 04-Oct-2013 04:01:55)

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Re: One man, one handgun, 100 lives saved.

Undeath wrote:
Xeno wrote:

Correct me if I am wrong, but I think more American civilians have been killed by gun violence than American military personnel have been killed in military combat.

Maybe it safer to be a soldier on active duty in US military than a civilian?


Sure, unless we're talking strictly numbers.  If technically more civilians die from gun violence, but say...its 1/1000 where as 1/500 in military service (made up numbers as I don't have time to find the correct ones atm)...then no.  Example, if John has 10,000 bad apples from his orchard, but joe has 300 it seems like John is screwed in comparison.  Only when you add on that John had a total of 1,000,000 apples and Joe had a total of 1,000 do you realize that only 1% of John's crop was effected while Joe lost 30% of his.
However you may want to look into getting a job as a statistician.  #1 priority is taking facts and scewing them to make them seem significant.

So, yeah, the equation for figuring it out would be number of civilian gun-related deaths per day divided by civilian population - not including population of military personnel on active duty - presented by year throughout US history.

(CGRDPD) / (C)

vs.

Military active duty personnel gun-related deaths per day divided by population of military active duty personnel  presented by year throughout US history.

(MADPGRDPD) / (MADP)

Einstein's good with numbers, apparently.  Maybe he can do the math?

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Re: One man, one handgun, 100 lives saved.

Don't forget that we have to figure out how to take out all of the police related fatalities as well, and since we're discussing the legalization of guns we can't take into account the deaths resulting from illegally owned guns.  So once we figure out the number of police related deaths as well as the deaths from illegal guns we can get an accurate number representing how dangerous it is to have legal firearms.

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