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Topic: Kyoto the failure

Oh Europe how have thee fallen... fallen on the sword of so-called righteousness you yourself created, and found it's edge to sharp for your own liking

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2005/may/15/20050515-094252-1586r/


Kyoto is a failure. The entire principle is a failure. Thus why the United States was NOT going to sign it, and will not sign it. Especially since the intent was to utterly destroy our economy at the same time.

Oh you thought you were smart. Timing it with a change over from coal fired to gas fired power plants. Timing it with the reduction of inefficient East German factories for efficient West German factories. Oh and France going to Nuclear.

When Europian Liberals realize they are not the same as American Liberals, stop attacking Republicans and then hand the American Liberals their head, then the United States can drop 20% of our carbon footprint via making Nuclear Power. But this will never happen. Your own actions doomed it, doom it here in the United States, and will keep dooming your efforts at reducing carbon in the atmosphere.

Your expensive carbon replacement programs make me laugh also.


I myself have planted trees. Not a small number, but hundreds. You take a hodad and you swing it, you pull the earth back, and you plant a tree. Simplistic in itself. Yet I wonder how many of you have planted even more than a dozen tree's (Which were not for your own property, or a friend/associates property mind you!).


These expensive boondoggles which are designed to fill the pockets of the scam artists of your nations will just keep you poor and down, and upset at the Rich United States. When will you wake up?

Everything bad in the economy is now Obama's fault. Every job lost, all the debt, all the lost retirement funds. All Obama. Are you happy now? We all get to blame Obama!
Kemp currently not being responded to until he makes CONCISE posts.
Avogardo and Noir ignored by me for life so people know why I do not respond to them. (Informational)

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Re: Kyoto the failure

Whys is it again a failure? UK, France and Germany and many others have decrease there emissions and some countries like Romania have almost half it!!! Yes in average the UE only decrease 1.5% but do you know what? USA increase there emission by 16 from 1990 to 2005. And what its even worse is that north america emission are almost the double from Europe!!!! Do you find Europe less competitive?

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Re: Kyoto the failure

Cheating with the timing is how England and Germany and France did it. Timing was pretty super favorable for them. Remove them and you look around.

Canada? Failed

Australia? Failed

Italy? Failed and wont participate in future ones

Spain? Failed utterly, removed itself from the treaty due to how bad they failed.


I could go on... but why should I? You keep bragging there and trying to act like it was a spectacular series of reductions by your nations there, instead of just good timing. Oh and if you include shipping and air transport... England is up 15%

Everything bad in the economy is now Obama's fault. Every job lost, all the debt, all the lost retirement funds. All Obama. Are you happy now? We all get to blame Obama!
Kemp currently not being responded to until he makes CONCISE posts.
Avogardo and Noir ignored by me for life so people know why I do not respond to them. (Informational)

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Re: Kyoto the failure

1- look at new data

"I could go on... but why should I? You keep bragging there and trying to act like it was a spectacular series of reductions by your nations there, instead of just good timing. Oh and if you include shipping and air transport... England is up 15%"

inclued LULUCF and UK is down by -58.8%

And the average of the EU in 2008 was -5% form the values of 1990, only 3% from the agreement which isn't far

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Re: Kyoto the failure

they didn't meet the agreement and their "reductions" include "carbon offsets"---if they claim to have bought greenhouse projects in Congo they say their output in the Ruhr doesn't count

The core joke of Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy is that of course no civilization would develop personal computers with instant remote database recovery, and then waste this technology to find good drinks.
Steve Jobs has ruined this joke.

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Re: Kyoto the failure

you need to take into account how politics work

you have a generation of politicians negotiating a treaty with medium to long term objectives that allows them to do nothing and pass the buck to somewhere along the line of a few election cycles who should then feel obligated to take the most painful decisions because their predecessors put their signature on a piece of paper

the problem with this plan is that it sucks, yes, but the politician where the buck stops will have to at least take face saving measures so the end result will tend to be a small but measurable improvement compared to when the treaty had never been signed

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Re: Kyoto the failure

speaking of germany.. yesterday i saw statistics.. germany is country with most reduction in energy consumption.
compared to 2006 consumers and industrie used 5.6% less energy while worldwide the average consumption went up by 2.5%.
We still are most exporting nation in the world.. our economy is growing again.
Reducing emissions (by saving energy you reduce emissions) does not have to harm your economy that big.
also.. germany has many new corporations working in field of isolations, energy efficiency and such.. its a whole new branch which is booming.. also strengthens our economy...
In the end a treaty is useless when it is treated like kyoto is...
It has to be countries own decision to do something.
In germany it works... could be an example to many other countries...

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Re: Kyoto the failure

Flint, the EU has committed itself to a more ambicious plan last year.. So you're at least wrong about Italy wink

God: Behold ye angels, I have created the ass.. Throughout the ages to come men and women shall grab hold of these and shout my name...

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Re: Kyoto the failure

You guys "reduce" by buying offsets in Africa.  That is bogus.  Just because our damned country is going to join in doesn't make it less bogus.

The core joke of Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy is that of course no civilization would develop personal computers with instant remote database recovery, and then waste this technology to find good drinks.
Steve Jobs has ruined this joke.

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Re: Kyoto the failure

Any plan to be more efficient is better than sticking your head up your arse and pretending that the rest of the world doesn't exisit.

Buying carbon off-sets in Africa sounds great, seeing this is a world problem, and its another way to push money into africa, where with a little responsibility by the west the poor there might get to live a better life...

noble europe, how right thee are...

"Sticks and stones may break my bones, but i am Jesus"
"Nothing is worse than a fully prepared fool"

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Re: Kyoto the failure

"You guys "reduce" by buying offsets in Africa.  That is bogus.  Just because our damned country is going to join in doesn't make it less bogus."

besides the reglementations they put on industry of all kind, indeed. Doesn't sound too bad as it is indeed a world-problem..

God: Behold ye angels, I have created the ass.. Throughout the ages to come men and women shall grab hold of these and shout my name...

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Re: Kyoto the failure

Yeah right.. any lil thing you do is better then doing nothing..
USA could easily do so much...

Try to bring filters in your industrial facilities on european, specially german standarts....
buy european cars instead of fuel hungry SUV

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Re: Kyoto the failure

"Australia? Failed"

Kyoto was ratified in our country less than 6 months ago. Our last government was in staunch opposition of it. Although we are one of the highest emitters of greenhouse gases on a per capita basis, this has coincided with our mining boom. Prior to that we were barely over Kyoto assigned limits, thus our government did not believe we were obliged to ratify it.

The rationale of Kyoto originally was to limit the AICs on their emissions because we've had our turn to grow. Think of the world as a big IC family.

Destiny is only for those too own to make their fate weak.

~ Geese

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Re: Kyoto the failure

shh geese, you are ruining his point.... he is a denier, they don't like facts it ruins their arguments...

"Sticks and stones may break my bones, but i am Jesus"
"Nothing is worse than a fully prepared fool"

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