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Re: Dutch Elections

Not a big deal on world level politics, but there should still be plenty of Dutchies around here!

Main topic this election has been the EU and the the credit trouble in the southern european nations like greece and spain.

Top party's fighting for the win:

PvdA = Centre left socialist lead by Samson
VVD = Centre right liberals lead by Rutte

Both seem to be heading for about 35 seats in parlement (150 seat total), so its gonne be a 3 party coalition atleast.

I voted D66 (centre democrats). Personally id like to see a coalition of PvdA, VVD and D66 with VVD as biggest party.


Any (prolly mainly dutch) views on it here??

<@Nolio> Ilu was the man back in the day,he even made monkeywrench and arganon look good for half a round =p
<@iluvatar> it is my grandest achievement
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<@iluvatar> still
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Re: Dutch Elections

"PvdA = Centre left socialist lead by Samson
VVD = Centre right liberals lead by Rutte

Both seem to be heading for about 35 seats in parlement (150 seat total), so its gonne be a 3 party coalition atleast."

Your country splits 3 ways over centrism???

The core joke of Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy is that of course no civilization would develop personal computers with instant remote database recovery, and then waste this technology to find good drinks.
Steve Jobs has ruined this joke.

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Re: Dutch Elections

google is your friend, since stupid questions doesnt exist, it must be you...

Colorado: even in the 11/01 war i made more hits.
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Re: Dutch Elections

?

The core joke of Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy is that of course no civilization would develop personal computers with instant remote database recovery, and then waste this technology to find good drinks.
Steve Jobs has ruined this joke.

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Re: Dutch Elections

atm it looks like

VVD 41
PvdA 40
PVV 13
CDA 13
SP 15
D66 12
GL 4
CU 4
SGP 3
PvdD 2
50plus 3

Colorado: even in the 11/01 war i made more hits.
Colorado: 447 blow jobs.
Big Gary:  Only a fool cannot admit when he's wrong...
AW:    i love rim jobs
RisingDown: I know you do

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6 Reply by Paininside (edited by Paininside 12-Sep-2012 20:38:39)

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Re: Dutch Elections

its usually split in, extreme left, center left, center right, extreme right. there issnt realy a 'middle center'

Colorado: even in the 11/01 war i made more hits.
Colorado: 447 blow jobs.
Big Gary:  Only a fool cannot admit when he's wrong...
AW:    i love rim jobs
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Re: Dutch Elections

May I suggest the Dutch adopt an absolute monarchy? Your political system looks painfully divisive.

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Re: Dutch Elections

Absolute monarchist titles: Ceasar, King, Emporer. Czar, Dictator, Director, President, Fuhrer (sp?)....

One mans monarch is another mans tyrant.

Everything bad in the economy is now Obama's fault. Every job lost, all the debt, all the lost retirement funds. All Obama. Are you happy now? We all get to blame Obama!
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9 Reply by Justinian I (edited by Justinian I 12-Sep-2012 22:40:09)

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Re: Dutch Elections

Flint,

Honestly, some countries would be better off with an absolute monarchy, like Egypt and Libya. It's obvious representative government won't work well in those countries. I mean, the Egyptians elected the Muslim Brotherhood!

As for the Dutch, I will be generous and assume they are more civilized than Libya and Egypt. However, the political menu available to the Dutch, as described here, looks rather dreadful.

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Re: Dutch Elections

> Justinian I wrote:

> May I suggest the Dutch adopt an absolute monarchy? Your political system looks painfully divisive. <

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

Please tell me that statement is ironic given your nationality Justi?

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Re: Dutch Elections

vote for dpenguins

So I told the cop, "No YOU'RE driving under the influence... of being a JERK!"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eFjjO_lhf9c

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Re: Dutch Elections

for seeing results from the past to compair it to now, for those who r intrested

http://www.parlement.com/9291000/modulesf/g18dztac

Colorado: even in the 11/01 war i made more hits.
Colorado: 447 blow jobs.
Big Gary:  Only a fool cannot admit when he's wrong...
AW:    i love rim jobs
RisingDown: I know you do

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Re: Dutch Elections

Justinian,

there are many different idees amongst the population and the political parties should somehow reflect that. I can't understand why it is a bad thing. You can always vote the next bad thing if you are disappointed. It makes for tough competition over the voters and that is what you need or the system doesn't work.

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Re: Dutch Elections

The Dutch will again support the german way in the crisis and that is all what matters.

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Re: Dutch Elections

There were (i think) 20 parties on the ballet. After the elections the largest party will start negotiations to form a coalition to secure atleast 76 seats in parlement.

VVD 41
PvdA 39

Thats what the current results seem to be. 3rd greatest party is at 15 (left wing socialists).

Parlement seems to be no trouble, with a 2 party coalition at about 80 seats.
However, these 2 parties together do not have a majority in the senate. And senate elections wont take place till 2014.

They will either need to take a 3rd party, prolly Christian democrats who took another heavy loss yesterday (21 to 13) or just go with the 2 of them and pray for some backing from the opposition in the senate.



Gonne be interesting either way to see how long this is gonne take. VVD and PvdA are pretty much condamned to eachother.

<@Nolio> Ilu was the man back in the day,he even made monkeywrench and arganon look good for half a round =p
<@iluvatar> it is my grandest achievement
<@Nolio> *half a round  =p
<@iluvatar> still
* Final_Doom is now known as Thanks_Iluvatar

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Re: Dutch Elections

@the yell

Theres to many parties to just say left or right. Short rundown of those who will be in parlement:

VVD 41 - centre right liberals
PvdA 40 - centre left democrats
PVV 13  - (heavy)right wing on EU and immigration, (heavy)left wing on social services. Lead by Geert Wilders
CDA 13 - Christian democrats, pretty much always in the coalition, taken a heavy beating. Centre right, work a lot with the VVD these last terms
SP 15 - heavy left wing socialists
D66 12 - The most central party imo. Very pro Euro. Democrats
GL 4 - Left wing green party
CU 4 - Christian party. A bit more focussed on religion then CDA
SGP 3 - Extreme christian party. Concerning religion, its stance is pretty much the same as the Republicans in the USA.
PvdD 2 - Animal party. Left wing
50plus 3 - senior party. New since this election


The other parties did not get enough votes for a seat in the house.

<@Nolio> Ilu was the man back in the day,he even made monkeywrench and arganon look good for half a round =p
<@iluvatar> it is my grandest achievement
<@Nolio> *half a round  =p
<@iluvatar> still
* Final_Doom is now known as Thanks_Iluvatar

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17 Reply by BiefstukFriet (edited by BiefstukFriet 13-Sep-2012 08:52:11)

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Re: Dutch Elections

The VVD and PvdA have a majority in the 2nd Chamber of Parliament (House of Representatives), however they don't have a majority in the 1st Chamber (The Senate/First Chamber of the States-General), which means they lack the seats to approve/decline laws put forward in the 2nd Chamber.

They can choose to accept the minority position in the Senate, and hope that they can find a majority there for their laws. Or they can make a coalition with a third party to gain a majority in the senate. Thus we can look forward to the following coalitions, in order of likelyhood, imho;




-'Centre' coalition: VVD, PvdA and CDA (Christian Democracts): 93 seats; majority in both Chambers

- VVD-PvdA: 80 seats; no majority in the 1st Chamber

- 'Broad Centre' coalition: VVD, PvdA, CDA and D66 (socially progressive Libertarians): 105 seats; majority in both Chambers

- 'Purple': VVD, PvdA and D66: 92 seats; no majority in the 1st Chamber

- 'Purple-plus': VVD, PvdA, D66 and GroenLinks (Greens): 95 seats; majority in both Chambers

- 'Left': PvdA, SP (Extreme Left Socialists), D66, ChristenUnie (Christian conservatives, centre), GroenLinks and Partij voor de Dieren (Animal rights party...): 76 seats; no majority in the 1st Chamber

Je maintiendrai

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Re: Dutch Elections

> Firewing wrote:

> The Dutch will again support the german way in the crisis and that is all what matters.

On fiscal matters the Dutch and Germans are almost always on the same line. But yes, Germany can rejoice and Greece can weep with these election results.

Je maintiendrai

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Re: Dutch Elections

for now Greece will still be bailed out, assuming they can get the budget straight this friday.
So far VVD and PvdA are both keen on keeping the eurozone together if possible, but all in all, our say is small, that matter is up to germany.

Im thinking they will go with CDA as 3rd party. Hope they can keep De Jager on economics. He's been doing a proper job

<@Nolio> Ilu was the man back in the day,he even made monkeywrench and arganon look good for half a round =p
<@iluvatar> it is my grandest achievement
<@Nolio> *half a round  =p
<@iluvatar> still
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Re: Dutch Elections

> Justinian I wrote:

> Flint,

Honestly, some countries would be better off with an absolute monarchy, like Egypt and Libya. It's obvious representative government won't work well in those countries. I mean, the Egyptians elected the Muslim Brotherhood!

As for the Dutch, I will be generous and assume they are more civilized than Libya and Egypt. However, the political menu available to the Dutch, as described here, looks rather dreadful.


I love the Dutch political landscape, actually. I would loathe a two-party system or a absolute monarchy.


Although I do believe her Majesty should get more power to keep the goverment 'in check'.

Je maintiendrai

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Re: Dutch Elections

> The Yell wrote:

> "PvdA = Centre left socialist lead by Samson
VVD = Centre right liberals lead by Rutte

Both seem to be heading for about 35 seats in parlement (150 seat total), so its gonne be a 3 party coalition atleast."

Your country splits 3 ways over centrism???


'Centre' being a relative term to differentiate those parties. The VDD and PvdA are quite far apart on many issues. Creating a Regeerakkoord, 'Governing Accord' / Roadmap for Governance will be interesting to say the least.

Je maintiendrai

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Re: Dutch Elections

> BiefstukFriet wrote:

>I love the Dutch political landscape, actually. I would loathe a two-party system or a absolute monarchy.


I do feel its a good system. However these elections show a much clearer result then the 2010 elections. I feel when the votes are spread out to much (i.a. 4 or 5 parties with 20+ seats) the coalition wont be able to represent a majority of the population due to all the concessions that have to be made.

I feel the voting ballet should be open like it currently is, however, a minimum of 4 or 5 seats is required to be able to take place in parlement.

<@Nolio> Ilu was the man back in the day,he even made monkeywrench and arganon look good for half a round =p
<@iluvatar> it is my grandest achievement
<@Nolio> *half a round  =p
<@iluvatar> still
* Final_Doom is now known as Thanks_Iluvatar

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23 Reply by [TI] Primo (edited by [TI] Primo 13-Sep-2012 10:00:11)

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Re: Dutch Elections

If the system works this way, it works well, 2 bigger parties that will probably take to a 3rd to cement the deal.

If the system works like it did 2 years ago, it is a different matter entirely.
At the point where no party holds more than 30 seats out of a 150, it is split up too much.
I for one would encourage a higher treshold, so parties such as the SGP, CU, PvdD, and as of today GroenLinks would have to merge to hold any form of power, and not every nutcase (Hero Brinkman) could start their own party with the potential to take votes away from decent parties

As for my political view, I vote VVD. I am very much pro-Europe, and I shiver at the thought of a socialist government (especially if it includes the SP). Might as well rename our country to Greece if Roemer is ever to hold power.

NEE NAW NEE NAW

Primo

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Re: Dutch Elections

oh my, it seems primo and i agree on something...

scary...

<@Nolio> Ilu was the man back in the day,he even made monkeywrench and arganon look good for half a round =p
<@iluvatar> it is my grandest achievement
<@Nolio> *half a round  =p
<@iluvatar> still
* Final_Doom is now known as Thanks_Iluvatar

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Re: Dutch Elections

I voted VVD as well.

Footnote to this election, the Dutch only bother to pester Muslims and immigrants during a (semi) good economy. I'll say it now, when the economic crisis has been 'solved' and economics will be pushed to the background of election rethoric, the PVV will grow again by 10 seats.

Je maintiendrai

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