Re: Is putting lasers on all your planets worth the effort?

I don`t remember the last time it stopped a determined attacker who was not a complete fool.
Must have been round 3 or something

The inmates are running the asylum

Re: Is putting lasers on all your planets worth the effort?

They probably won't stop a determined attacker. However, they will stop an opportunist from attacking an undefended planet without a portal.

Re: Is putting lasers on all your planets worth the effort?

Lasers will not prevent anything.

What they will do is slow down attackers. Bombers are cheaper than lasers to build in mass quantities. Laser trapping that planet to 5000 lasers will cost you WAY more than the guy who's building 50k bombers. It's also less useful.

I always build lasers, I tell people to build lasers, but honestly, they don't prevent anything except easy raids.

Modestus Experitus

Arby: A very strict mod, reminds me of a fat redneck who drives a truck around all day with a beer in one hand. I hated this guy at the start, however, I played a round in PW with him where he went as an anonymous player. Our fam got smashed up and everyone pretty much left. Arby stayed around and helped out the remaining family. At the end of the round he revealed himself.... My views on him have changed since. Your a good guy.....

Re: Is putting lasers on all your planets worth the effort?

I build them to prevent easy raids just like Arby said. That being said though I know players who demo them once the port comes in.

<&InSaNe> so for reference tco has a ticklish bumhole
<@SerialBusiness> good to know. I will make a note of this

Re: Is putting lasers on all your planets worth the effort?

Yeh being ground run and then another fams bankers are taking your planets from you with 100 solds and 1 tran is never fun for you tongue

"I lie down next to an angel, fall asleep and fly with the demons"
I once prayed to god for some planets, but quickly found out he didnt work that way

Re: Is putting lasers on all your planets worth the effort?

usually ur amount of lasers is 2-3% ur amount of buildings, that's not a big loss. u could raze them to replace them with expensive buildings(since that will be OB) once u are fully portalled.
The thing is that if an attacker brings ur ground to nothing, a banker with 0 bombers can finish the raid...
Having 20 or 30 lasers everywhere wont stop any attacker with 30k or 50k bombers, the best is to have different amount of lasers on ur plts.
If u put 30 lasers everywhere an attacker will need like 32k bombers to take 100 plts. If you put 5 lasers on half your plts(the smallest) and 55 on half (your biggest) an attacker will need 60k bombers to take 100 plts. And you will have spent the same amount of resources than building 30 everywhere.

'Success! The realm of Genesis has been reduced to dust! Our forces are leaving the planet though, as it is scheduled for demolition to make way for a new hyperspace bypass.'

Re: Is putting lasers on all your planets worth the effort?

lol kollop ur funny

Leap ahead

Re: Is putting lasers on all your planets worth the effort?

explain evilrunt...

Colorado: even in the 11/01 war i made more hits.
Colorado: 447 blow jobs.
Big Gary:  Only a fool cannot admit when he's wrong...
AW:    i love rim jobs
RisingDown: I know you do

Re: Is putting lasers on all your planets worth the effort?

you ruined my artwork painside, but this post sets it back to greatness

Leap ahead

Re: Is putting lasers on all your planets worth the effort?

IMO - if you're going to build 20/30 lasers per planet, you may as well not have any.  Let me explain.

As an attacker you almost 100% expect ur enemy to have 20/30 lasers per planet,  thats standard.  So already you have failed to be unpredictable.

Lasers are useful early in the round, sure, but later they become a nuisance.  If your ground is high, you have set up effective anti raid fleets, your not fully portalled everywhere,  you have a secondary fleet stationed and your active,  then your need for lasers is reduced. 

However, If your not as active,  i suggest you go extreme and have 40 lasers per planet.  it will lower your planet loss each round by about 60% garunteed.  Be smart about where you explore and keep track of your enemies.

Lasers are OK, but any big fam can jump 10k bombers on each player, bankers included without breaking a sweat. 

So go high or don't bother.

"It's very quiet on the political arena. I wish someone would stir up some trouble!"

11 (edited by K 19-Aug-2012 06:55:19)

Re: Is putting lasers on all your planets worth the effort?

Hrm, what about having a random number of lasers all around? The goal, as always, is to try to slow that attacker down if you are unpredictable. Having a planet with 20 lasers, having a planet with 200 lasers, and having a planet with 2000 lasers in a system I would think would just cause an attacker to slow down if they are not sure. Having a system of 40 lasers and then having that one planet with 500 lasers can sometimes really stop, agitate, and frustrate the attacker, again slowing them down. That's at least been my experience on both sides of the equation. But what do I know, I haven't played this game in years o.o.

~K

Re: Is putting lasers on all your planets worth the effort?

Orbit is correct.

A few rounds ago, when I was extremely planet fat (over 1k planets) I was avg of 40 lasers per planet. A good idea is to build 1/3 your planets a low laser count, 1/3 a middle count, and 1/3 a high count. Mix them all up. Confusing an attacker is key. Make they waste more bombers per fleet.

Modestus Experitus

Arby: A very strict mod, reminds me of a fat redneck who drives a truck around all day with a beer in one hand. I hated this guy at the start, however, I played a round in PW with him where he went as an anonymous player. Our fam got smashed up and everyone pretty much left. Arby stayed around and helped out the remaining family. At the end of the round he revealed himself.... My views on him have changed since. Your a good guy.....

Re: Is putting lasers on all your planets worth the effort?

Its all a mindgame and highly dependant on your situation.

Some rounds i get away with no lasers, some rounds i need many paired with agents, always review your diplo situation is my advice. But always keep in mind that eventually lasers will get useless, so try not to get tooo many

LORD HELP OREGON

Re: Is putting lasers on all your planets worth the effort?

A couple people have said these points already, but let me sum things up.

In short:
1. Always vary lasers counts. NEVER have the same amount of lasers on all your planets.
2. Always mass build lasers across various planets. NEVER build lasers on planets individually.
3. Don't go overboard with lasercounts. A determined attacker will still get through.
4. Use alternative ways to prevent yourself from getting raided. Do not rely solely on lasers.
5. NEVER fully portal (100%).
(6. Always build lasers. Otherwise people without bombers will be able to raid you)

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

In depth:

1. Always vary lasers counts. NEVER have the same amount of lasers on all your planets.
Try not to become predictable. If you have the same number of lasers across all of your planets, you become an easy raid target for an attacker: he can just send the same (small) number of bombers to all of your planets, and grab them easily.
As Kollop said: "If u put 30 lasers everywhere an attacker will need like 32k bombers to take 100 plts. If you put 5 lasers on half your plts(the smallest) and 55 on half (your biggest) an attacker will need 60k bombers to take 100 plts. And you will have spent the same amount of resources than building 30 everywhere."


2. Always mass build lasers across various planets. NEVER build lasers on planets individually.
Infils are an attackers best friend. An attacker will love you if you build lasers on planets individually, as his infil will plainly show him how many bombers he has to send per planet to fail none. Always stack several layers of lasers on top of each other, using different groups of planets to build different numbers of lasers. Make those infils extremely confusing to attacks, so that they will have to waste ops on random PI's. Combined with point 1, they may still not get the complete picture with the random PI's and still fail tons of attacks.


3. Don't go overboard with lasercounts. A determined attacker will still get through.
As Arby3 said: "What they will do is slow down attackers. Bombers are cheaper than lasers to build in mass quantities. Laser trapping that planet to 5000 lasers will cost you WAY more than the guy who's building 50k bombers. It's also less useful. "
Not only are those lasers costing you more than it is costing the attacker to jump bombers. The attacker will be able to just use the bombers to raid tons of planets, they are not at all a drawback for him. He will now just be able to hit more planets at the same time, making him perfect for doign the cleanup job after someone has ran ground.


4. Use alternative ways to prevent yourself from getting raided. Do not rely solely on lasers.
As Orbit said: "Lasers are useful early in the round, sure, but later they become a nuisance.  If your ground is high, you have set up effective anti raid fleets, your not fully portalled everywhere,  you have a secondary fleet stationed and your active,  then your need for lasers is reduced.  "
Anti raid fleets are where you station a part of your fleet on a(n unportalled) planet, so that when you get raided while you are offline, and your ground is getting ran/has been ran, an attacker can simply take that planet from you. This will cause the remaining fleet that was stationed on that planet (after fleet losses) to be recalled to the main fleet, preventing the opposing attackers from taking your remaining planets with small fleets. As an attacker, it is a delight to find out you can trigger those 50 droid fleets you'd sent and grab massive amounts of planets with little to no fleet. Do not let this happen to you!


5. NEVER fully portal (100%).
This is to prevent your ground from being ran easily. If you are portalled on 100% or even 95% of your planets, it will be very easy for opposing attackers to send big fleets to enough of your portals to run your ground down to nada. Remember, every time an attacker takes a portal, he can kill up to 15% of your main ground fleet. 2 max kills and you're down to below 3/4 of your original ground. 4 max kills and you're almost down to 1/2. Leaving planets unportalled may make the attackers who work less securily or lack op support (in the form of IP's) to waste big fleets on unportalled planets, possibly leaving them stuck with hovering fleets that they cannot trigger because your ground hasn't been ran down enough. Alternatively, it can make attackers waste fleet on spreading out big fleets across multiple planets to ensure that they hit a portal. In both cases, it means you're giving them a harder-than-usual time.

Maar doodslaan deed hij niet, want tussen droom en daad,
Staan wetten in de weg en praktische bezwaren,
En ook weemoedigheid, die niemand kan verklaren,
En die des avonds komt, wanneer men slapen gaat.

Re: Is putting lasers on all your planets worth the effort?

5. NEVER fully portal (100%).

If your going to play it safe tongue
always fully portal, but destroy some afterworths, else infils still show that u hvvnt build them! if one would be keeping track of it that is.

Colorado: even in the 11/01 war i made more hits.
Colorado: 447 blow jobs.
Big Gary:  Only a fool cannot admit when he's wrong...
AW:    i love rim jobs
RisingDown: I know you do

Re: Is putting lasers on all your planets worth the effort?

hehehe fair point tongue although I doubt many people are that dedicated to keeping infils up, but there may be some!

Maar doodslaan deed hij niet, want tussen droom en daad,
Staan wetten in de weg en praktische bezwaren,
En ook weemoedigheid, die niemand kan verklaren,
En die des avonds komt, wanneer men slapen gaat.

17 (edited by Render 23-Aug-2012 16:45:29)

Re: Is putting lasers on all your planets worth the effort?

I supose you're talking about infra players, not attackers.

well for infra players, they tend to be fat, the reasonible thing is to progressively build lasers as the round advances and before you get portals. My advice always in HQ is to build this amounts

2-3 lasers for the very 1st day attacks are allowed (in case you're in a unsafe map position)

add 2 lasers each day until you reach 6-7 lasers

the next step comes when early raids are more predictable bcause you have located enemy attackers getting spots at maybe 3 or 4 tickers to your borders (not to your core), the round has just started and somebody jumping bombers only for an early raid can affect his whole fam economy, so you have to be sure any early raid on you is a fail.  For this stage I recommend 11 lasers, because many unskilled attackers tend to send circle numbers (100 bombers in this case).

In the next days you might add lasers to your planets and make it 11-16 lasers each, and of course start 1 portal in any system you're in.
Next step is 16-22 lasers, and now you have a portal so you'll need a small defensive fleet for retakes with 250 bombers and 500 figs. In this stage attackers are constanly removing threats and/or trying to settle spots to enemy cores, and this can create a big conflict, so any infra player with less than 22 lasers is badly defended.

I cannot say exactly what week&year belongs to any stage, as the rounds are different depending on your family  goals, activity, map position, etc..

But what's sure is, next stage is to up lasers to 22-33 while you are fully portalling your planets, from now on, as   you are 100% portaled in core it comes to a new phase, where you can randomly set from 33 to 44 lasers in each planet, depending on its size, and choose 1 of them in every important system where you set a lasertrap of 70, 80 or even 100 lasers. That will make sure you can retake any other planet you lose in the system, your enemy will never send 1000+ bombers in the initial raid fleet.

After midround you can decide to raze them all and place good infra instead, but this depends on the scenary, the threats, the naps, possible cancel wars, etc.. I'd do that only in the inner core systems, and always keeping the one lasertrap in every system to make sure you can do instant retakes.


As for attackers defense I'd definatly go for the strong lasery defense. A normal HC att keeps a nice contruction bonus most of the round, so you can have all your spots at 500 RCs built and someday before you jump your fleet for a war you can decide to add 500+ cheap lasers in every strategical spot. That would definatly prevent you losing hot spots to ranged attacks unless the threat is so big and dont mind to lose 2k bombers in any attack.

If you are a very active one, and the family economy is good enuf, and you're at war, its always a good choice to add 11 lasers every tic, or 22 every 2 tics, etc.. Notice the enemy will send strong fleets and not always is able to PI when he's hovering, so if he's using info from an infil you might ring the surprise bell and kill all his transports.

So definatly, lasers are a very important defensive structure if you know when/where/howmany to raise in any different stage of the round.

Re: Is putting lasers on all your planets worth the effort?

My advice for early in the round is to build soldiers and station.  dont go crazy with lasers just keep building them slowly,  keep your infiltrate busy.  Soldiers are better for long term defence.  once ur lasers are killed they are gone... bad investment.  once you lose a planet with soldiers, you still have some left to fight another day.

"It's very quiet on the political arena. I wish someone would stir up some trouble!"