It's in France...

health care only applies to certain things

we have stick rules here in canada

it came up elsewhere...is that horseback riding thing true?

"Is that coochie real?"
"It's real expensive!"

I disagree. It's their choice, I don't see how this is a fraude. A lot of people lie about their former relationships, this isn't much different.
If they're willing to pay such a ridiculous amount of money for it, let them. It's a shame they hold on to virginity so much though..

The french health care system doesn't deviate much from the belgian one, Chris.

Not at all. This is estethic surgery, much like a boobjob or something.

And "right-wing bible thumpers" usually have more in common with Islamic hardheads than with people like me (atheists) Chris..

> Alan Statham wrote:

> I disagree. It's their choice, I don't see how this is a fraude. A lot of people lie about their former relationships, this isn't much different.
If they're willing to pay such a ridiculous amount of money for it, let them. It's a shame they hold on to virginity so much though..

The french health care system doesn't deviate much from the belgian one, Chris.

the fact of the matter is they do hold virginity with such high regard, and you have to consider that. and their culture is just as valid as yours. the woman said if women dont have their virginity they're dirt. Fooling a man into a relationship with dirt is cheating him of what his culture views as a respectable relationship, its defrauding him. i dont see how its any less criminal then putting a ferrari body on the core of a honda and selling the car as a ferrari. if there was a purpose other then fooling someone into thinking you're still a virgin, then maybe the doctor shouldnt be arrested if he didnt know, but i mean, the only possible scenario i can think of is if some extremely rich couple had a fetish, but if thats the case, all the surgeon would have to do to make sure it wasnt a case of fraud, was make sure the husband knew of it.

"you mean boobjob's arent included in the healthcare? what kind of horrid place do you live in?!"

In my country it is included... but only if you had breast cancer or an accident

"you mean boobjob's arent included in the healthcare? what kind of horrid place do you live in?!"

Reconstructive boobjobs are supported. And when a psychiatrist claims it's really damaging your mental health, you can get a refund. I meant the breast enlargements people, wich have only an esthetic reason. And that place would be Belgium, wich is well known for its great and extended health care.

"the fact of the matter is they do hold virginity with such high regard, and you have to consider that. and their culture is just as valid as yours. the woman said if women dont have their virginity they're dirt. Fooling a man into a relationship with dirt is cheating him of what his culture views as a respectable relationship, its defrauding him. i dont see how its any less criminal then putting a ferrari body on the core of a honda and selling the car as a ferrari. if there was a purpose other then fooling someone into thinking you're still a virgin, then maybe the doctor shouldnt be arrested if he didnt know, but i mean, the only possible scenario i can think of is if some extremely rich couple had a fetish, but if thats the case, all the surgeon would have to do to make sure it wasnt a case of fraud, was make sure the husband knew of it."

I never claimed I regard their culture less then mine, that would be an awesomely silly statement. I just think that if you'd consider this as a fraud, it'd be really discriminating, as this whole virginity issue is only valid for women.

All I'm trying to say is this:

The whole virginity thing is discriminating, as it only applies for women. It's discriminating cause women are the ones who have to undergo the operation and have to pay for the whole thing. As you said it's a cultural thing, but we shouldn't bend our laws for certain groups for such things, defenatly if they're as discriminating as this.
Regarding such things as fraud would only encourage cases like this, and women who aren't a virgin anymore will be regarded as "social widows".
It's not about disrespcting their culture (wich I find an offensive remark), it's about drawing the line between culture and constitution.

"
The whole virginity thing is discriminating, as it only applies for women."

men also loose their virginity....

"It's discriminating cause women are the ones who have to undergo the operation and have to pay for the whole thing."

women dont need to undergo an operation at all. and those that do to hide that they lost their virginity are committing fraud and should be arrested.

"As you said it's a cultural thing, but we shouldn't bend our laws for certain groups for such things, defenatly if they're as discriminating as this."

i dont see how its bending the law. if the women found out that the man wasnt a virgin, as long as your laws would allow her to do the same thing, i dont see how its discriminating.

"Regarding such things as fraud would only encourage cases like this, and women who aren't a virgin anymore will be regarded as "social widows"."

they would only be considered social widows in the small muslin community. most men wouldnt care, or alot of men, you can tell that it broke while riding a horse...

"It's not about disrespcting their culture (wich I find an offensive remark), it's about drawing the line between culture and constitution."

its about being threatened by their culture so you're looking for areas where your rights are threatened so that you can attack it. muslims didnt create women with hymen. evolution did. its a weaker case to argue discrimination against women in this area then it is to argue discrimination against men because when we conceive a human embryo with a woman, the woman gets to make all the decisions regarding the embryo.

Virginity = the lack of sexual contact and that is separate of physicality and special for itself

Reminds me of the joke about a husband and wife on their wedding night. They'd never slept together and the man is looking forward to suprising the bride. So before she even has her shoes off he comes out of the bathroom naked.

"Hi honey! Do you know what THIS is?"

"Uh huh" giggled the bride. "That's your wee-wee".

"Ah honey, that's a [manly synonym for wee-wee], a [manly synonym for wee-wee]" laughed the groom.

"No, I've seen those. THAT'S a wee-wee"