1 (edited by HotDogBun 25-Mar-2012 04:32:39)

Re: Florida Teen Shooting

I just wanted to put this out here. Nobody can say for sure what happened yet, and nobody can say for sure if the shooting of Trayvon Martin was murder of justified self-defense. I have no preference as to what happened, so i am not interested in making assumptions about what took place in order to fulfill that preference. A lot- honestly the majority- of people want this to be a racially motivated murder in cold blood of a black teen by a angry white guy, and as a result they are only talking about and repeating things that reinforce that narrative. Some of these things are true, some are the truth being stretched, and others are fabrications. Nowhere in the national media or online social media are we seeing a defense of Zimmerman, or even devil's advocacy, nor is there any call to withhold judgment until all the facts are in. It seems that a lynch mob has formed, calling for Zimmerman's head. This story has become a circlejerk of racial outrage. It is disgusting how quickly America has leapt to judgment. As this giant angry snowball rolls down the hill growing by the day, it is missing some pretty vital details and information. I'd like to introduce you to something everyone seems to have missed or ignored or dismissed.

You won't be seeing this on your facebook feed, or on twitter, or on the national news programs. It won't get voted to the front page of reddit.com or digg.com or be shared on tumbler. It is likely to be met with scorn here as well, and be marginalized by people who like to make up their minds before they have enough information to be properly informed. This is a video of an interview with the only EYEwitness to any of the events before Trayvon Martin was shot. This is literally weeks old. http://www.myfoxtampabay.com/dpp/news/state/witness-martin-attacked-zimmerman-03232012



Can any intellectually honest dialogue be had about this case after a week long witch hunt?


*Edit: Wrong Link

"See and Let Yourself Be Seen" - Robin Trower, Little Bit of Sympathy

"Do What Thou Wilt" - Aleister Crowley, Liber al Legis
**************************************************************
"The desperation in peoples eyes for a job to support themselves and/or their family... is palatable." -Einstein, http://www.imperialconflict.com/forum/v … ?id=157429 (post #18)

Re: Florida Teen Shooting

what's really hilarious about all the people "rallying" who didn't know Trevon, is, the shooter is not white

I cant fault greiving family but the rest are just ornery

I don't know what happened.  Either a neighbor shot down a vicious brawler, or a renegade wannabecop murdered an innocent teen, or a  renegade wannabecop shot down a vicious brawler.  Darn if I know which one is correct

The core joke of Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy is that of course no civilization would develop personal computers with instant remote database recovery, and then waste this technology to find good drinks.
Steve Jobs has ruined this joke.

Re: Florida Teen Shooting

"what's really hilarious about all the people "rallying" who didn't know Trevon, is, the shooter is not white"

"Zimmerman" sounds white enough. Never mind that he's half-white half-Hispanic.

Brother Simon, Keeper of Ages, Defender of Faith.
~ ☭ Fokker

Re: Florida Teen Shooting

> Simon wrote:

> "what's really hilarious about all the people "rallying" who didn't know Trevon, is, the shooter is not white"

"Zimmerman" sounds white enough. Never mind that he's half-white half-Hispanic.


So I guess Lenny Kravitz is white now.

"See and Let Yourself Be Seen" - Robin Trower, Little Bit of Sympathy

"Do What Thou Wilt" - Aleister Crowley, Liber al Legis
**************************************************************
"The desperation in peoples eyes for a job to support themselves and/or their family... is palatable." -Einstein, http://www.imperialconflict.com/forum/v … ?id=157429 (post #18)

Re: Florida Teen Shooting

yes havent you heard him play

The core joke of Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy is that of course no civilization would develop personal computers with instant remote database recovery, and then waste this technology to find good drinks.
Steve Jobs has ruined this joke.

Re: Florida Teen Shooting

"So I guess Lenny Kravitz is white now."

You can say that about a lot of people, but it doesn't make it true. Sensationalism and ignorance may go hand in hand.

Brother Simon, Keeper of Ages, Defender of Faith.
~ ☭ Fokker

Re: Florida Teen Shooting

> Simon wrote:



>Sensationalism and ignorance may go hand in hand.


This entire affair is sensationalized ignorance, from misreporting the shooter as white, to only showing pictures of Treyvon as a child (and never showing pics of him at 17), lying about ZImmermans history of calling 911 (he called regarding whites as often as blacks), and ignoring the ONLY eyewitness there is.

"See and Let Yourself Be Seen" - Robin Trower, Little Bit of Sympathy

"Do What Thou Wilt" - Aleister Crowley, Liber al Legis
**************************************************************
"The desperation in peoples eyes for a job to support themselves and/or their family... is palatable." -Einstein, http://www.imperialconflict.com/forum/v … ?id=157429 (post #18)

8 (edited by V.Kemp 25-Mar-2012 07:08:14)

Re: Florida Teen Shooting

Thanks for the link, HotDogBun.

I haven't read particularly much (and there's not particularly much to read) about this story and haven't presumed to know what happened. Though it's funny how, though I have caught a number of TV news stories on it, none of them mentioned the eyewitness or injuries to Zimmerman.

Edit: OR the age of the photos shown. I was curious about that, because the photos suggest he was a hell of a young looking 17 year old.

[I wish I could obey forum rules]

Re: Florida Teen Shooting

Hotdogbun before this I felt you a racist. Now I stand confused as to your other posts, but I do not think you a race baiter.

Please accept this as righting my wrongful thinking of you.

Now I did not check any of the story before, because I knew race baiting was going on.

Sadly people die in the United States all the time. Lots of whites, asains, blacks, hispanics, natives, and more.

That this story vaulted to the top seemed to me artificial and destined to tryy to be a rallying call at election time.

And now we see it is based all on lies as well.

Everything bad in the economy is now Obama's fault. Every job lost, all the debt, all the lost retirement funds. All Obama. Are you happy now? We all get to blame Obama!
Kemp currently not being responded to until he makes CONCISE posts.
Avogardo and Noir ignored by me for life so people know why I do not respond to them. (Informational)

Re: Florida Teen Shooting

> Einstein wrote:

> Hotdogbun before this I felt you a racist.


WHY?

>Please accept this as righting my wrongful thinking of you.


Ok.



>That this story vaulted to the top seemed to me artificial and destined to tryy to be a rallying call at election time.

The media loves ratings. People love outrage, be it screaming at town hall meetings on one side or screaming racism on the other. I don't see this still being an issue by election time, and even if it is, I don't think either side could get any real mileage out of any of it.

"See and Let Yourself Be Seen" - Robin Trower, Little Bit of Sympathy

"Do What Thou Wilt" - Aleister Crowley, Liber al Legis
**************************************************************
"The desperation in peoples eyes for a job to support themselves and/or their family... is palatable." -Einstein, http://www.imperialconflict.com/forum/v … ?id=157429 (post #18)

Re: Florida Teen Shooting

The kid's mother said "they" killed him and "they"'re trying to smear his reputation. Who? The half-hispanic KKK? The man? I wish she'd be more specific and less of a trashy moron.

I feel bad for him now. Not because he's dead. Because his mother is a dumb [itch]. She's trademarked "Justice for Trayvon" and "I am Trayvon" too. I'm sure she's too dignified to want to profit from her son's death.

[I wish I could obey forum rules]

Re: Florida Teen Shooting

quick trademark "We Are Trayvon" and sell it to her

The core joke of Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy is that of course no civilization would develop personal computers with instant remote database recovery, and then waste this technology to find good drinks.
Steve Jobs has ruined this joke.

Re: Florida Teen Shooting

Lol @ Chris Why not beat her to profiting right? tongue

Race is always going to be blown out of proportion because contrary to popular belief (does anyone actually believe it? so...yes...sarcasm) we are not a unified country. People will always hold onto the past to dictate their feelings on the present.

When a black man kills a white man, it is on the news big time that some "gangster" strikes yet again and kills some "civilized" "upstanding" citizen. We all know that isn't true though I hope.

When a white man (no Zimmerman is not white) kills a black man of course it tends to not make news quite as often. But now with the fact we have a black president the media is starting to take notice of these instances (and rightfully so) and make a bigger thing out of them.

We can and should fault the media for allowing this to get out of control so quickly before they actually had all the facts. They quickly decided that:

1. Shooter was white
2. Trayvon was a very good "kid"
3. Shooter was racist

When so far the facts coming out are far from that. Now Trayvon's family is of course going to fight this battle that the media offered them on a plate without ever taking the time to wait for the facts to come out.

White, black, asian, green, purple, it doesn't matter....we all have bad apples and the sooner a parent starts realising that their child may not be some perfect little angel sent by the devil the better off we will be as a country.

Last time I checked it was an American that assaulted another American and got shot for it. And until proven otherwise....it will stay that way.

Solis - #7872

Re: Florida Teen Shooting

once the "revren shapton"  or his other hypocritical partner jesse sinks their teeth into something. They start bringing the bus loads of people to yell scream loot whatever.

Re: Florida Teen Shooting

Funny also, it seems like every thug that gets shot here in Chicago was " gunna be a docta, football playa, basketball playa, he wuz a good kid." 


well wtf was he doing on the corner slinging dope at 2am on a school night?

Re: Florida Teen Shooting

Generally when someone gets shot in a similar situation and they were legitimately "good people", they fall into the 1% of casualties. Not to say that more good people don't die, just not in that type of situation. 

No matter the race.

Solis - #7872

Re: Florida Teen Shooting

Who knows, I mean it comes down to exactly what they did and how they acted

I could get shot for flapping my arms like a bird and hollering "booga blah! booga blah!" and a jury might acquit if they felt my "victim" FELT she was under attack*

(*or if they read my comments here)

since the shooter is the only one who saw him shoot and he gets the presumption of innocence by our system, I doubt anything will be done

now if he goes on to kill a Peruvian girl in his locked hotel room then we'll say "oh wow he probably was guilty then, too"

The core joke of Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy is that of course no civilization would develop personal computers with instant remote database recovery, and then waste this technology to find good drinks.
Steve Jobs has ruined this joke.

Re: Florida Teen Shooting

"since the shooter is the only one who saw him shoot and he gets the presumption of innocence by our system, I doubt anything will be done"

Umm, Chris there was a witness that backs up the story of the shooter all the way to the point of him pulling the trigger it seems. So, I think its a fair assessment to say that he was indeed in fear of his life if his head was being bashed on the ground.

Solis - #7872

19 (edited by V.Kemp 29-Mar-2012 06:27:50)

Re: Florida Teen Shooting

Am I the only one offended by everybody crying "RACIST!"?

As far as I can see, there's no evidence to suggest Zimmerman was a racist.

People are saying video evidence suggests he wasn't so terribly injured, the "kid"'s mom is a dumb [itch], some are saying this wasn't an official neighborhood watch... etc etc. I'm not claiming to know what happened and I, like every other sensible human being, hope that the facts determine the course of action.

But where's the evidence of racism? Zimmerman identified the person he saw to the 911 operator with a sensible descriptor they'd want/ask for. He'd called before about people of other races just as often.

Everybody who's positive this was a racially motivated killing offends me. Where's the evidence? Maybe Zimmerman's a weirdo wannabe neighborhood watch captain who killed Trayvon in cold blood. But where's the evidence of racial motivation?

[I wish I could obey forum rules]

Re: Florida Teen Shooting

Well details are coming out now, and it seems the Democrats really fudged this race baiting episode up.

Zimmerman is a registered Democrat and a Hispanic male He had a broken nose and trauma to the back of his head consistant with his story of Trayvon bashing his head on the ground repeatedly. Oh and he mentors a black kid in his spare time.

Trayvons Twitter account is named No_Limit_Nigger, he has been suspended from school for drug possession, having burglary tools, and other criminal offenses. Trayvon's cousin alludes to an assault on a bus driver as well.

The witness says he saw certain parts of the events go down, all of which supports Zimmerman.

Meanwhile the hysteria has left a lot of people thinking Zimmerman is guilty of murder, of racism, and more.

But the evidence shows that he did act in self defense (in fear for ones life) and that Trayvon is quite a trouble maker.

So we have the potential for a highest order backfire on a number of the media, politicians, and activists which could cause the Democrat party to lose more seats come November unless all those that pushed the agenda back track, apologize, and acccept the huge loss of face they will take. I do not see that happening.

I think they will try to squelch the story, but since it is breaking on Drudge and Beck... it will be on Hannity, then O'Reilly, then more... and the outrage is going to dissapear against Zimmerman, only to be replaced with a resolve to vote against the Democrats for falsifying a story.

Another side effect: Latino's outraged at the painting of one of their own as racist when he is in fact a great guy will cause many of them to shift Republican in the next few elections. This can be pushed... and to be frank and honest... should be pushed... so we can end these sort of race baiting excercises by the left.

Everything bad in the economy is now Obama's fault. Every job lost, all the debt, all the lost retirement funds. All Obama. Are you happy now? We all get to blame Obama!
Kemp currently not being responded to until he makes CONCISE posts.
Avogardo and Noir ignored by me for life so people know why I do not respond to them. (Informational)

Re: Florida Teen Shooting

If I put a $10,000 dollar bounty, dead or alive, on the head of the New Black Panthers how long do you think it would take for the FBI to arrest me for a hate crime?


Reverse discrimination extraordinare!

Everything bad in the economy is now Obama's fault. Every job lost, all the debt, all the lost retirement funds. All Obama. Are you happy now? We all get to blame Obama!
Kemp currently not being responded to until he makes CONCISE posts.
Avogardo and Noir ignored by me for life so people know why I do not respond to them. (Informational)

Re: Florida Teen Shooting

I heard about the one guy who was arrested (he getting charged or are the media and the prosecutors going to quietly forget about him?) on weapons charges (he's a convicted felon), but what about that guy? That's obviously offering payment for kidnapping, and that's obviously got to be illegal. I'm positive they'd lock my ass up if I did it. He hasn't been arrested, has he?

[I wish I could obey forum rules]

Re: Florida Teen Shooting

But Einstein!! he wuz gonna be a docta!!

Re: Florida Teen Shooting

http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Journalism/2012/03/31/NBC-Fanning-Flames

The friggin media pushing it as if racism was happening.

Everything bad in the economy is now Obama's fault. Every job lost, all the debt, all the lost retirement funds. All Obama. Are you happy now? We all get to blame Obama!
Kemp currently not being responded to until he makes CONCISE posts.
Avogardo and Noir ignored by me for life so people know why I do not respond to them. (Informational)

Re: Florida Teen Shooting

Zimmerman was a community organizer. He organized a black neighborhood. He also saved a blackman from false charges from a white police officer (the officer actually beat the black man, Zimmerman got justice for him).

Zimmerman was looked upon as a good man by the local black community.


Trayvon was into drugs, violence, and theft. He had many suspencions from school and even his twitter account showed his character in the name.


The President and others tried to start a race war so they could drum up support for the 2012 election. The President is not raising funds fast enough, nor getting volunteers. This was seen as a way to get the black community to come out in numbers for the President.


Once a race baiter, always a race baiter.  BRIETBART LIVES ON!

Everything bad in the economy is now Obama's fault. Every job lost, all the debt, all the lost retirement funds. All Obama. Are you happy now? We all get to blame Obama!
Kemp currently not being responded to until he makes CONCISE posts.
Avogardo and Noir ignored by me for life so people know why I do not respond to them. (Informational)