Where does a socialist government  controls everything you do? or does not allow you to be free, prosperous and secure?

@ Freelancer

Are you seriously asking me that question ??  I just never know on this forum.  Im assuming you jest.

Bw, it seems to me like you associate everything good with the right wing and everything bad with the left. socialists by definition want a more balaced spread of power. it makes no sense for you to say that he assumes ppl want power becos they are socialists.

"no no dude.  do not twist my intent."
if i twisted your intent it was only because you did not express it clearly in the first place.

"I believe Iraqis are people.  Not animals that need the caged, controlled atmosphere of a dictator......as people here think."
but you do not believe that they are capable of achieving this themselves as the western democracies have?

"You secure the violence, disarm the militias, and let people talk out their differences, instead of settle it on the street.
Proof that they can be democratic ??   The amount of people that come out to vote.  Thats proof."
yes people there want a democracy. i never said they didnt. my point is that unless they have to put the effort in themselves as all current world democracies did, they will not truy understand the basis of democracy nor the privilege that it is, and so it wont work there.

"And, all you did was assume.  You asked nothing, you drew a false conclusion, and then you told us how smart you are."
would you like to show me sum evidence rather than just saying things?

"Funny, how I the conservative stands behind democracy and less control.
You do not.  Say, let them live in chaos, and let it sort itself out."
remember mate, i am a conservative as well, though half the time you sound more like a socialist to me. i stand behind democracy. but i do not believe that it is a gd idea to try to give them democracy, fail, causing a civil war of sorts in a country like iraq. believe they will reach democracy themselves.

@ Archy....

dude, it seems to me that you Assume to much.  What kind of wide stroke statement is this:
". . .it seems to me like you associate everything good with the right wing and everything bad with the left. . ."

The rest of what you wrote is basically, leave Iraq, and let them sort it out.

Do you believe its better to let the armed camps slug it out, until there is a winner, and hope they are a Democratic system w/o central control ?

You did assume....again.  You said nothing, asked nothing.  Yet, you say I "said nothing"?

I stand behind my statement.  Given the Opportunity, people will live democratic, prosperous, secure and free.
Coalition forces are their after the ouster of Saddam, to help build an infra, and to provide security.
Iraqis have elected a parliament, have representation of the different factions, and need to work out the democratic process for Iraq.....and not the separate factions.

Iraqis are taking the security part over as well, more and more so.  Iraqi units work side by side with coalition forces now.  Iraqi security is provided in major swaths of Iraq, w/o the presences of coalition forces.

The process is working, yet people still stand on the fact that Iraq cant have a democracy. 

Conservative or not, you have a twisted stand.

Yea....Im an optimist.  I believe in people.  I dont like Govt.  The larger a govt. the worse.  All that is good is freedom.  All that is bad is Govt.

What you people miss is that vital part of what I stand for.  Socialism is bad for people.  Socialism looks great on paper, but is a terminally flawed system of slow death for an economy and a society.......

@ Freelancer
W/O choice, there is no freedom.  Socialism offers no choice, controls the direction, and stifles and squashes innovation.