26 (edited by Chris_Balsz 27-Aug-2010 16:35:02)

Re: Would you vote for an atheist?

>>While absurd to even suggest their actions were due to "godlessness" Is this assumption that being a believer means people are less likely to question your moral character leading us down the route where an atheist will pretend to be something they are not?<<

Hitler wasn't atheist, he was a warped Deist, thought he was the instrument of Providence

Stalin DEFINITELY acted out of godlessness, why else break the churches in Russia?

the reason we think atheists tend to be amoral isnt becasue we're ordered to think so

we know so many atheists, that is why.

many vocal atheists are making it up as they go along, like Christopher Hitchens, and they demand respect for the sacred intellectual journey

which in every context, not just religious, is totally frakin annoying.

The core joke of Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy is that of course no civilization would develop personal computers with instant remote database recovery, and then waste this technology to find good drinks.
Steve Jobs has ruined this joke.

Re: Would you vote for an atheist?

Hate to say this, but alot of religious people aren't so squeaky clean either. It's worst actually especially when you claim to have access to an absolute standard of morals and dictates from the Creator himself.

Bill Gates and Warren Buffett are atheists and neither had any problem pledging away 95% of their respective wealth to aid mankind. And here's the kicker btw, neither of them believes that their acts of generosity are going to earn them brownie points in the afterlife, which makes what they did more praiseworthy than any equivalent (not that there are many examples ironically) act done by some joe who believes in karma or that he's being watched from on high.

Re: Would you vote for an atheist?

Bill Gates likes how Windows has got better and better since Win98

nuff said

The core joke of Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy is that of course no civilization would develop personal computers with instant remote database recovery, and then waste this technology to find good drinks.
Steve Jobs has ruined this joke.

Re: Would you vote for an atheist?

I would vote for an atheist as well as a religious man. I don't care.

"But only if he promises to eliminate ALL the church priviledges and give all that (WASTED!!) cash to workers."

I disagree on that. I do think some religions earned the right to exist, if only for cultural reasons. UNESCO protects buildings, sites, impertant natural habitats and cultural events. I think they should consider to add religious rituals (like the friday prayers in Islam and so on) to that list.
The cultural significance of these rituals obliges us to fund them, as well as to maintain the religious buildings we hold them in.
The group of people that's still going to church etc is getting smaller, they shouldn't be paying for all the church's costs. They simply can not finance it. And the cultural significance of religion applies to all anyway tongue

God: Behold ye angels, I have created the ass.. Throughout the ages to come men and women shall grab hold of these and shout my name...

Re: Would you vote for an atheist?

> tavius wrote:

> Hate to say this, but alot of religious people aren't so squeaky clean either. It's worst actually especially when you claim to have access to an absolute standard of morals and dictates from the Creator himself.

Bill Gates and Warren Buffett are atheists and neither had any problem pledging away 95% of their respective wealth to aid mankind. And here's the kicker btw, neither of them believes that their acts of generosity are going to earn them brownie points in the afterlife, which makes what they did more praiseworthy than any equivalent (not that there are many examples ironically) act done by some joe who believes in karma or that he's being watched from on high.>

They invest those sums in to charity foundations they create because it allows them to avoid estate taxes. A lot of super rich people do that. And Bill Gates supports income taxes on WA residents who make $200k or more because he wants to eliminate competition. We all know how ruthless and sly Gates is.

31 (edited by Render 28-Aug-2010 03:23:23)

Re: Would you vote for an atheist?

@Khaz
Richard Dawkins annoys me as he has gone a step further then the God delusion argument where he now states that religion is the only force to make good people do bad things - I think the millions of "good" germans who went along with the Nazi party would beg to differ on that issue.

Yes, in the way religion invented the sins, so you are a good person until you comit a sin, and religions choose the sins at their convenience, while, if you forget about religions and focuse on basic moral, selfrespect and respect for the others (humans, animals and the planet we live on), you dont need a list of sins to know wether you're good or bad, so you dont need religion at all.
about the "good" germans burning people with flamethrowers and massively killing jews, well, that was a war, a cruel one, and like any other war, once you are into it you know you gonna kill or be killed, that makes you a bad person for the rest of your life, and the moral limits in those cases are exceeded.

@East
what's your point? I have been known to watch porn, but that doesn't mean I treat women as sluts by definition

yes but you wish to find one that likes to be treated as a slut tongue  lol, that's called the 'basic instincts', there are women who watch that porn too, you only have to find them tongue

"Also Stephen Hawking's position is not relevant. Obviously the existence of a divine being can be neither proven nor disproven. It would be unscientific to claim that god doesn't exist. We can only say for sure that we haven't seen any conclusive evidence of him existing. What we do know is that many claims of religions are either false or inconclusive when you apply scientific methods to them."

When did humanity start wondering about a divine being?? I'll tell you, our ancestors in the caves, the first time they stared at the stars in a clear night, so, in this way, Hawkings have a point.

32

Re: Would you vote for an atheist?

> Douglas Reynholm wrote:

> I would vote for an atheist as well as a religious man. I don't care.

"But only if he promises to eliminate ALL the church priviledges and give all that (WASTED!!) cash to workers."

I disagree on that. I do think some religions earned the right to exist, if only for cultural reasons. UNESCO protects buildings, sites, impertant natural habitats and cultural events. I think they should consider to add religious rituals (like the friday prayers in Islam and so on) to that list.
The cultural significance of these rituals obliges us to fund them, as well as to maintain the religious buildings we hold them in.
The group of people that's still going to church etc is getting smaller, they shouldn't be paying for all the church's costs. They simply can not finance it. And the cultural significance of religion applies to all anyway tongue


And I agree with it, Cathedrals are part of our culture and we must keep them, but when I see all the luxury at Vaticano and how good bishops and deacons live, while their religion clearly says a man of god has to meet vows of poverty to be closer to Jesuschrist, and when I see most people at church are there to show their new fur coats, ... things like that turn me fool about church and religions in general.
Because there are real 'sons of god' helping the homeless and unfortunate with the few they got to live, sacrificing their life for the others in distant countries, and they, the real christians, arent reflected in that shameful court of richmen.

33 (edited by Rendezvous 28-Aug-2010 03:45:50)

Re: Would you vote for an atheist?

The fact is you feel compassion for others irregardless of religion, it is in our nature. They will be exceptions but religion has no more effect on compassion than other environmental factors.

And I hate abuse, abuse of power is bad enough. But abuse of power under the name of a Almighty is much worse as you cannot reason with faith as faith does not have anything to do with fact.

Re: Would you vote for an atheist?

I would.  However, you will never get the US to vote for a political leader that does not have some religious affiliation.

So I told the cop, "No YOU'RE driving under the influence... of being a JERK!"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eFjjO_lhf9c

35 (edited by Justinian I 28-Aug-2010 04:12:33)

Re: Would you vote for an atheist?

I think you could get an Atheist elected under the right conditions. If there was a time of great peril, with everyone's careers and families on the line, and an Atheist was the only one qualified for the task, I have no doubt they would be elected.

Personal convictions are too expensive in adversity.

Re: Would you vote for an atheist?

if only the vast majority of people didn't turn to religion during times of great peril

So I told the cop, "No YOU'RE driving under the influence... of being a JERK!"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eFjjO_lhf9c

Re: Would you vote for an atheist?

"And I agree with it, Cathedrals are part of our culture and we must keep them, but when I see all the luxury at Vaticano and how good bishops and deacons live, while their religion clearly says a man of god has to meet vows of poverty to be closer to Jesuschrist, and when I see most people at church are there to show their new fur coats, ... things like that turn me fool about church and religions in general.
Because there are real 'sons of god' helping the homeless and unfortunate with the few they got to live, sacrificing their life for the others in distant countries, and they, the real christians, arent reflected in that shameful court of richmen."

True that, but that's not what I meant by preserving religious tradition tongue

God: Behold ye angels, I have created the ass.. Throughout the ages to come men and women shall grab hold of these and shout my name...

38 (edited by Little Paul 28-Aug-2010 11:54:05)

Re: Would you vote for an atheist?

I think we should slowly start to dismantle religion in europe. It is largely unfair that the majority of us should pay for some old farts who still want to go to church. I admit, they were more or less brainwashed to believe and they can't help it but still. You can preserve the buildings but for me that's all.

In any case, there are to few priest or followers anyway so it will come to an end sooner or later. Also note how they don't scare kids anymore with stories of heaven and hell.

Re: Would you vote for an atheist?

> V.Kemp wrote:
> In a godless universe, the logical course of action is to get away with as much as will benefit you. <

In a heavenless universe the logical course of action is to behave yourself lest someone end your life early.
And badly.

__________
__________

> Chris_Balsz wrote:

> the reason we think atheists tend to be amoral isnt becasue we're ordered to think so
we know so many atheists, that is why. <

"We know so many atheists" ... care to clarify that statement, because I get the feeling that you're talking about American Atheists, and if they're anything like American Theists, I am insulted that you think of me like that.
I'm an arsehole, and I'm an Atheist, I'm not a lying, stealing, murdering, raping psycho.


> many vocal atheists are making it up as they go along, like Christopher Hitchens, and they demand respect for the sacred intellectual journey <

Christopher who? Sounds like a head teacher, "Good morning school." "Good morning Mr Hitchens."
So, what? He thinks he's knows how it all should be and demands worship for it? That's not an Atheist, that's a self-proclaimed god. Atheists don't do gods.

And by the same token; Many vocal Theists are hyppocritical cowards who can't hold themselves up to their own standards, let alone their god's.


> which in every context, not just religious, is totally frakin annoying. <

Burn them at the stake!
"Burn! Burn! Burn! Burn! Burn! Burn! Burn! Burn!"

"So, it's defeat for you, is it? Someday I must meet a similar fate..."