Topic: Is Socialist Europe about to Fail?

Interesting story today, showing how every Europian nation except the Nordic ones are in a panic and trying hard to forstall collapse.

Hiking retirement ages up

Charging for schooling (college and uni)

Reducing unemployment packages such as guaranteed pay after unemployed

Reducing or eliminating pay per child policies

Reducing pensions

Reducing public employee pay (14 months pay a year in Greece, wow!)

And reductions in costly green programs.




It looks bad, the numbers on one website were pretty grim. Foxnews has a story as well. To think Europe may be forced out of Socialism entirely just to survive...

And all because you guys made a united currency and death of one nation (greece) means you all would fall... but your still falling, just not as fast.

Everything bad in the economy is now Obama's fault. Every job lost, all the debt, all the lost retirement funds. All Obama. Are you happy now? We all get to blame Obama!
Kemp currently not being responded to until he makes CONCISE posts.
Avogardo and Noir ignored by me for life so people know why I do not respond to them. (Informational)

Re: Is Socialist Europe about to Fail?

Without the euro, many European nations would already have lots of troubles during the crisis. It is a simplification to say Greece is the sole problem here.

Re: Is Socialist Europe about to Fail?

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2010/05/23/financial-crisis-threatens-europes-cherished-social-welfare-benefits/
(AP news story, I just linked to it on FOX's site because that site has it on one page)

It's the same old story. They say it'll actually help their economies to do all of these things. But it doesn't.

Like it says in the article, they started cutting government payrolls first because they were the least politically explosive; but those cuts weren't nearly significant enough to balance their budgets. Massive deficit spending is not sustainable. Shocking realization yet to come to some.

[I wish I could obey forum rules]

Re: Is Socialist Europe about to Fail?

Hiking retirement ages up
well this just makes sense as life expectancy goes up.

Charging for schooling (college and uni)
Universities have always charged, there has never been a free uni.
Colleges in my country are still free.

Reducing unemployment packages such as guaranteed pay after unemployed
Unemployment payment was never gaurunteed, you need to prove you are seeking employment to recieve a package and after so many months government can give you a "do this job or we stop paying" choice.

Reducing or eliminating pay per child policies
Certainly not true in my country, cant comment on others

Reducing pensions
State Pensions are being reduced world wide as life expectency goes up, how is the state pension in America?

Reducing public employee pay (14 months pay a year in Greece, wow!)
One Country, wages aint decreasing but are either freezing or having a smaller increase then expected

Also lots of European countries aint part of the Euro.

Re: Is Socialist Europe about to Fail?

I dont consider germany a nordic country but here only few of the above are true.

"Hiking retirement ages up"
Well thats true, it was just raised from 65 to 67. But that is somehow logical since people today tend to live way longer.

"Charging for schooling (college and uni)"
Partly true, some states started charging 500

Re: Is Socialist Europe about to Fail?

Read the news story then comment Khaz

Everything bad in the economy is now Obama's fault. Every job lost, all the debt, all the lost retirement funds. All Obama. Are you happy now? We all get to blame Obama!
Kemp currently not being responded to until he makes CONCISE posts.
Avogardo and Noir ignored by me for life so people know why I do not respond to them. (Informational)

Re: Is Socialist Europe about to Fail?

14 months pay a year?? WTF?

Even California aint' that fricking stupid!  ...our workers just demand 20% wage hikes tongue

The core joke of Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy is that of course no civilization would develop personal computers with instant remote database recovery, and then waste this technology to find good drinks.
Steve Jobs has ruined this joke.

Re: Is Socialist Europe about to Fail?

Here's how it works guys

index your current budget at 100

you want 103

you demand 110, be argued down to 103

next budget cycle you demand 110, be argued to hold 103.  You're just arguing to argue but make it good

next budget cycle you demand 110, argue for 105 as bare minimum to hold inflation

next budget cycle is election year, holler like hell for 110 and take whatever

next budget cycle likely has change of leadership, go to them and say " we told you 5 years ago we needed 110, never got it, DAMMIT when is our department gonna be fully funded???!!!"

The core joke of Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy is that of course no civilization would develop personal computers with instant remote database recovery, and then waste this technology to find good drinks.
Steve Jobs has ruined this joke.

Re: Is Socialist Europe about to Fail?

German budget deficit to break EU rules in 2010
http://www.eubusiness.com/news-eu/1231921022.85/

That they haven't managed to cut your costs in ways which you find objectionable yet isn't a sign that their spending is sustainable. It's just a sign that it's so unsustainable that no measures to correct it can be passed without unrest.

[I wish I could obey forum rules]

10 (edited by Schniepel 24-May-2010 07:38:08)

Re: Is Socialist Europe about to Fail?

US had or has a huge deficit budget aswell and you dont have our kind of welfare state.
As this article says its about stimulus package. Banks were bailed out aswell.

Re: Is Socialist Europe about to Fail?

The picture is not as black and white as painted here, but I kinda agree. Europe has been too socialist and has to man up now to get better. No big deal.
The Netherlands are moving in the right direction, the liberal conservatives are becoming the biggest party (according to polls) for the first time ever. Mind you, liberal conservatives in the Netherlands would still be shot for communism in the USA.

Neelie Kroes for Prime minister!
(alternatively me for prime minister!)

NEE NAW NEE NAW

Primo

Re: Is Socialist Europe about to Fail?

All those corrections to the welfare state were being discussed and put in place well before the crisis. The crisis merely sped things up a bit.

Je maintiendrai

Re: Is Socialist Europe about to Fail?

"Hiking retirement ages up"

Well average age its not 70 something like it was a couple decades ago...

"Charging for schooling (college and uni)"

Universities always had tuition in my country, although if your parents are below a certain pay grade there will be no tuition.

"Reducing or eliminating pay per child policies"

In my country those programs did have an increase.

"Reducing pensions"

The higher pension did suffer a negative impact, alhough the lowest ones had an increase above the inflation.

"Reducing public employee pay (14 months pay a year in Greece, wow!)"

True

Re: Is Socialist Europe about to Fail?

One must point out though, that Greece it's politics are considered to be outlandish by our standards. It's no wonder that they're chin deep in debt.

Je maintiendrai

Re: Is Socialist Europe about to Fail?

The above are all true in the UK which is not part of the Euro.

tweehonderd graden, dat is waarom ze me mr. fahrenheit noemen, ik reis aan de snelheid van het licht, ik ga een supersonische man van u maken

Re: Is Socialist Europe about to Fail?

1>
EUROPEAN, EUROPEAN, EURO[beep]INGPEAN!
EU RO PE AN
Like "You're a peon", yeah?

2>
Wait, socialist Europe? Er, newsflash:
http://www.sanfranciscosentinel.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/fall-berlin-wall.jpg

3>
Going by the only two actual sources available, and what I know of the subject; you think Europe is about to collapse horribly because:
Britain is promising that it really, really, really, will fix their black-hole of a benefit system that it has been promising to fix in every election since 1997,
the Germans have announced that their economy is going to be into the red by exactly 1% for the next financial year,
and Greece is fucked if it doesn't attract lots of tourist-dollars this summer.

That's business as usual for us, sorry to pee on your strawberries.
[/thread]?

"So, it's defeat for you, is it? Someday I must meet a similar fate..."

Re: Is Socialist Europe about to Fail?

hey that's true

you're always circling the bowl

what were  we thinking

The core joke of Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy is that of course no civilization would develop personal computers with instant remote database recovery, and then waste this technology to find good drinks.
Steve Jobs has ruined this joke.

Re: Is Socialist Europe about to Fail?

You do know that we've been "circling the bowl", as you Americans seem to need to phrase it, since the summer of 1945, right?

Look man:
  The touristy [STATES] always crap their pants at every economic downturn, however slight, because it means nobody has enough money to spend on flying 3000 miles just to look at some 2000 year old, hand carved, white marble, amputee porn.
  The money [STATES] always run things close to the wire, and always seem to go "into the red" with cold military-like calculation at just the right time to catch enough of the economic flak to keep everyone depressed rather than collapsed.
  The intellectual [STATES] always seem to fail to fix their most basic of flaws, even though they swear they're going to get around to it later, because they always get distracted by "intellectual discourse" with their neighbours.

"So, it's defeat for you, is it? Someday I must meet a similar fate..."