Re: Peaceful Planet Transfer

Yea but what abut lasers could I just buiding mass laser traps and build planegs the  pass off seems over powering . Sure I think player could pass off but at a price of making planet empty

Re: Peaceful Planet Transfer

Maybe stronger yes, but it would also make sense right? Why would lasers shoot at friendlies? Should be able to transfer that as well

Re: Peaceful Planet Transfer

I like pie wrote:

Worse, it also reflects the gap between extremely active teams and those who aren't as fortunate to always have people online, a gap that we should be closing if we want to retain new/casual players.

A)
For what you had in mind it will... IF the price to pay for transfer is still that all lasers and portals get destroyed (which can be done automatically as soon as the receiver pushes the "accept planet"-button).

If you keep it that way, nothing on the tactic & strat front changes and passing planets gets a bit more comforable.

B)
If you also introduce this seemingly little change about lasers and portals staying intact, the changes to the game will be HUGE, probably the biggest change ever done in IC, bigger than morale and look how morale changed the game. Morale changed the game to specialization with some interessting and some dumb roles but no role as exciting as it was before specialization.

Swapping planets as you want inbetween players without any price and that's what we are really talking about when lasers and portals stay intact, is the mother of all incitement to specialisation and using every specialized advantage possible. And as some players have already noticed, we are not only talking about attacker/banker or building but also about exploration, sneaking into systems (small players), swapping, attacking... while in peace times the planets are parked with the player with the highest income bonus... and so on.
From a team perspective it is a challenge to orchestrate, from a player perspective it will become even more boring than now.

BUT since the implications are so high, the remaining player base will be probably busy for over a year to really think of all the new strategies possible and another one to finetune... and that might be good.


So you have the choice, A) is what you had in mind and makes one small aspect of the game more comfortable (btw: exactly one of the things I would rather make much more difficult).
Or you chose B) which will go into IC-history probably as the "hugest slight change ever". Since you aren't aware of the implications, I would advise not to do it or you are giving the direction into which IC is/should go completly out of hand.

Another old bloodstained Harkonnen.

Re: Peaceful Planet Transfer

That's a useful analysis, thanks Altruist.

I'm aware of the implications, but I don't think they're necessarily bad.  You have a good point about role specialization and in general I think it does hurt the game, but this feature doesn't have to exist at the expense of independent play styles.

On the contrary: I see this feature as reducing the dependency players have on fitting into an optimized communication cadence.  In that way, this could actually promote some self sufficiency within a team setting.  At least in terms of time.

Regardless, I don't think "nothing on the tactic & strat front changes" is the goal, or should be.  The current tactics and strats that we use are a reflection of the game's shortcomings.  They absolutely should change, because what we have now clearly hasn't been working for quite some time.  We shouldn't abandon everything but we shouldn't resist evolution either.

The harsh truth is that we don't have many active players and even within an active family, family members aren't always responsive enough to be helpful.  The game must adapt accordingly if we intend to retain players, even if it means rocking the boat.

The comforting thing is that, in the end we can have it both ways.  If this does get implemented it will be as a galaxy setting that we can easily disable (and subsequently fix) if it all goes wrong.  Given that, there's not much to lose by trying.

No pain, no gain. smile

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30 (edited by Altruist 22-May-2017 05:42:50)

Re: Peaceful Planet Transfer

I like pie wrote:

The comforting thing is that, in the end we can have it both ways.  If this does get implemented it will be as a galaxy setting that we can easily disable (and subsequently fix) if it all goes wrong.  Given that, there's not much to lose by trying.

No pain, no gain. smile

It's really great that you (re-)introduced what was once (really long time ago) known as custom games and probably implemented with greater flexibility than it was in the past. It's such a great way to experiment or to just take a walk on the wild side to experience some change.

And as a matter of fact, the implications of moving planets while they stay fully defended by lasers and portals (and without regard of the NW of the receiver), are so interesting... heck, if Starstrike and me were still playing I'd see us exchanging page after page to crunch through the different possibilites. He'd probably agree with me that it isn't a change we would wish for in the long run but, as I said, for a walk on the wild side just to see what all is possible... highly thrilling.

Another old bloodstained Harkonnen.

Re: Peaceful Planet Transfer

A walk on the wild side indeed.

You just wait until I finish splitting the tick. wink  Weekend flash rounds updating on the minute are gonna be insane.

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Re: Peaceful Planet Transfer

If you want the game to continue in the direction of hyper-coordination, specialized roles, etc. then it would be a nice quality of life improvement - thats if you can make it so it doesnt open up new disruptive strategies or tactics.

However I would argue that this is patching a problem whose root cause is actually the existence of specialized roles(and hence, planet passing) in the first place. I have always been of the view that intra family coordination should be limited to attacks, politics, wars, etc. and should not be there for building/infrastructure.

Re: Peaceful Planet Transfer

I can respect that view, although I don't think that opening up new disruptive strategies is a bad thing if we do proceed with this.

There is a potential split in gameplay that could solve this on both sides.  The other end of this extreme is to entirely forbid intra-fam attacks, but that only will make sense if we ditch morale entirely, otherwise the size-morale penalty makes attacking impractical very quickly.

If we were to do that, attackers would be forced to keep their gains, and would have to optimize their own infra to stay competitive.  Meanwhile, bankers would be forced to attack on their own if they want to sustain their growth.  The line between the two would definitely blur, and SS could become the new dominant style.

Of course, the problem there is that some players simply don't like attacking or don't like banking.  Then again, this wouldn't be a permanent change either, and we could mix up galaxy settings between rounds which will help keep things fresh.

The end result is an "intra-fam attacks" setting, instead of a "peaceful takeover" flag:

A) "Classic" (what we have now)
B) Peaceful (the original idea in this thread)
C) Forbidden (SS-focused, requires morale to be disabled)

My eventual goal is to support short/fast/small galaxies as a core part of the game's experience, in which case people could try all 3 in a relatively short amount of time, and then focus on playing whichever type they like best.

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