My strategy doesn't involve land combat. The US could probably crush China's army in a conventional land battle, but there is no way we could take the country. The US is still unchallenged on the seas, and I am suggesting we use it to destroy China's fleet and blockade them. Without food imports, China's government will be forced to capitulate.

Of course, denying humanitarian aid violates UN rules, and I am suggesting we ignore them. If the EU gives us crap about it, we can always mention how Britain denied food imports to Germany in WW1 and firebombed Dresden in WW2.

To restate my reasons for going to war. China has started an arms race. I'm not so concerned about its army, but its fleet is unacceptable. They want Japan, South Korea, and Australia to think about what Beijing will think. That is why a war is inevitable. It will hurt the US a lot, but it will hurt more if we delay.

we'll lose a Nimitz class carrier to subs and that'll be it, our fatheads in Washington will declare we can't get within 900 miles of China anyhow, so why not admit it in a treaty promising to stay 900 miles away.

Seriously, America now prides itself on being too smart to be honorable

clearly china is infrawhoring and jumping their ressies. We let them get too much pop over the last 200 years. go raid them

"The thing that most non-US people hate about the US, is the way that you guys think its OK if you have a massive army and use it to exert control over the rest of the world, but as soon as someone else starts to build an army you declare its an "arms race" and that they must be stopped."

Well duh

can't exert control over the rest of the world if somebody else builds an army to stop us

btw how do you like the absence of world war between industrialized nations? You're welcome.

> The Yell wrote:

> "The thing that most non-US people hate about the US, is the way that you guys think its OK if you have a massive army and use it to exert control over the rest of the world, but as soon as someone else starts to build an army you declare its an "arms race" and that they must be stopped."

Well duh

can't exert control over the rest of the world if somebody else builds an army to stop us

btw how do you like the absence of world war between industrialized nations? You're welcome.

----------

Well until recently, the "idustrialized nations" consisted mostly of West Europe and the US - now unless you're going to claim that the US has had a stabilising impact on Europe since WW2, then all you guys have done is to go to war with other "non-indistrialized" nations to war, whether for profit (Iraq) or to stamp out ideologies that you dont agree with (Vietnam). Oh and you took out a controlled demolition on your own World Trade Centre just to justify going to war.

Its always interesting for me to see the way that US citizens respond to their country's actions. At first I gave the benefit of the doubt and assumed that most disagree with the choices of their leaders but I'm slowly realising that the majority actually enjoy fighting wars. It almost seems as if there is no limit to what American people will do to go to war "legally" or "for the greater good".

"Well until recently, the "idustrialized nations" consisted mostly of West Europe and the US - now unless you're going to claim that the US has had a stabilising impact on Europe since WW2,"

America has had a stabilizing influence on Europe since WW2.  You don't occupy each other to enforce debts anymore.  Well, I guess I'll have to wait and see how you treat the PIIGS

". Oh and you took out a controlled demolition on your own World Trade Centre just to justify going to war."

WHATEVER.

The Fuzz, while I agree with you that US citizens have been entirely too complacent to their leaders war-mongering on account of being corporate whores, the fact that the USA is a democratic republic and china is an authoritarian regime of tyrants is significant. The US has problems, but by comparison they're God and His holy angels next to China.

LOL BiefstukFriet. So true.

Our problem is sheeple following/being bought by corrupt, corporate-whore war-mongering politicians. As Cougar points out, there are meritorious actions which the US military has engaged in. There are certainly legitimately good things the US military can do for the world and for itself. But, because we're also frequently involved in bombing pill factories to distract from presidential adultery, wars for corporate profits, etc., we lose a lot of the ability to claim moral superiority.

I certainly value freedom and despise tyranny, but when our government has supported tyranny half of the time, it's hard to make the claim that all of our actions are just. I certainly love this country and the freedoms we enjoy/have fought for, but we have sent our young men and women to die in vain at times. We've had politicians meddling with war efforts, greatly reducing their effectiveness. We've bombed peoples who were no threat to us.

Libertarian or GTFO, bunch of socialist, war-mongering corporate whores.

More worrying than China's fleet jumps is China's economy.

Forced sterilizations!

Forced abortions!

Currency manipulations!

A massive gender gap which will prevent 700 trillion men from having any chance of finding wives! (I researched that number; it's totally accurate)

Frequent hacking of US government computers! This one might be just, but I want to hear the justification!

A MASSIVE poverty rate!

Cover-ups of virtually all information. What information is let out isn't let out honestly. Want to research crime rates and government-crackdown practices in China? Good luck with that!

Freedom is inherently moral and economically beneficial. Communism is evil and stupid. And this post should have ~Wornstrum~ answering questions for a week, with any luck!

The nature of the economic warfare is such:

Even if western nations, after much social upheaval, strife, and social unrest, were to adopt the same standards of living and business practices that the Chinese do (which is what makes them competitive), we still would not be able to compete, because the Chinese would be in a position to subsidize their production more than western countries can theirs.  The big mistake the west is committing right now is continuing to attempt to compete with the Chinese, for by doing so standards of living must be diminished, and, more worryingly, the values upon which western democracies were founded must be eroded.  Another mistake is the notion that western countries are "developed" and can rely almost exclusively on their "service-based" economies.  This notion needs to be replaced with the understanding that all countries are developing, some faster than others (western countries arguably not even growing enough to keep pace with inflation and thus not really growing at all but rather contracting significantly relative to population increases).  There needs to be general consensus among western countries for there to be significant growth in all sectors of economies, be it manufacturing, agriculture or services; that each is as valuable as the other to an economy over all; that a "service-based" economy is not a developed economy at all, but, rather, a wounded economy, one whose agriculture and manufacturing sectors have become victims of economic warfare.

Wornstrum:

China made war against those who saw themselves not as Chinese, but as other entities entirely.

Some of these regions had a culture so steeped and progressed there is no legitimate way to say they thought themselves even remotely Chinese.

They were soveriegn nations of their own right. They were choosing their own paths in history and had no intent on China ag all (so no claims of self defense).

Under your premise, that prior ownership and strength of arms is legitimate, then China, as well as much of the world, belongs to England. Europe belongs to the Italians, North Africa to Egypt, the Arabian Penisula to Israel (ok only Jordan, a bit more of Syria, Lebanon, and Egypt.... oops wait they won lands in wars and held them... ok all of Lebanon and the Sinai), Greece owns everything to the Ganghes River, and Mongolia also has ownership of Russsia and China.

Might does not make right, nor does prior historic ownership.

China is evil, imperialistic, and they use an excuse of prior ownership dating back so many generations ago that it fails on the face of current reality.

I am sorry the Native Americans cannot seize the United States and use a lie that grandious for their claims.