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Re: Nooooooo Twinkies

... What does "warned" mean to you?

Make Eyes Great Again!

The Great Eye is watching you... when there's nothing good on TV...

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Re: Nooooooo Twinkies

im very offended. i expect him to be forum banned for violating the warning and spewing multiple personal insults at me

So I told the cop, "No YOU'RE driving under the influence... of being a JERK!"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eFjjO_lhf9c

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Re: Nooooooo Twinkies

twinkies will do this to a man

qsudifhkqsdhfmsklfhjqmlsdfhjqkmsldfhjmqklsfhmqlsfhjqmsklfhqmskjdfhqsfq
sdffdgjfhjdfhgjhsfsdfqgsbsthzgflqkcgjhkgfjnbkmzghkmqrghqmskdghqkmsghnvhdf
qmkjghqmksdjqlskhqkmsdhqmskfhjqmskjdfhqkmsdfjhqmskfhjqkmsjdfhqkm
sjfhqkmsjfhqkmsjfhkqmjsfhqksdjmfhqksjfhqskjdfhnbwfjgqreutyhaerithgfqsd
kjnqsdfqsdfqsdfmkjqhgmkjnqsgkjmhzdflmghjsmdlghjsmdkghmqksdjghq

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Re: Nooooooo Twinkies 

twinkies will do this to a man

Amen brother.

As for flint, I'm questioning the behavior of the top executives to give themselves raises when they know they might file for bankruptcy earlier in the year.

How would you like it if your boss gave himself a hefty bonus and then comes by you and say, hey flint, you gotta pack up and go, cuz we don't go no money for gas.

Brother Simon, Keeper of Ages, Defender of Faith.
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Re: Nooooooo Twinkies

Heh.

CEO: The company is teetering. Staying could ruin my prospects for future employment (tarnished image). I am leaving.

Execs: Here is your risk pay to stay

CEO: Sigh, ok

Everything bad in the economy is now Obama's fault. Every job lost, all the debt, all the lost retirement funds. All Obama. Are you happy now? We all get to blame Obama!
Kemp currently not being responded to until he makes CONCISE posts.
Avogardo and Noir ignored by me for life so people know why I do not respond to them. (Informational)

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Re: Nooooooo Twinkies

Heh what? Risk pay for CEOs who brought a company down to a point that even requires a risk pay to keep its CEO? A regular worker who f*cks up will no doubt get reprimanded maybe even fired, but a CEO that f*cks up gets more pay? That's some downwards spiral logic you got there.

Brother Simon, Keeper of Ages, Defender of Faith.
~ ☭ Fokker

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Re: Nooooooo Twinkies

Welcome to Wall Street Simon. Please sit, it's only 10 dollars.

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Re: Nooooooo Twinkies

And that is why John Lewis is the best company ever.

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Re: Nooooooo Twinkies

Union demands bankrupt company. Company forced to deal with ridiculous union bosses looking out for themselves at a cost to union members. That's 100% of this thread's content.

I propose that the company shouldn't have been forced to deal with the lousy union to begin with. Oppression just cost tens of thousands of jobs.

The guys watching the machines and pouring in sugar weren't skilled laborers to begin with (or they'd have no need of a union). They should have given thanks that they had a job at all--considering their lack of education, skill, and productivity--and shut their mouths. But, because of union-government collusion and corruption, they just lost their jobs. All to benefit union bosses who make many times more than them and who didn't lose their jobs.

God forbid the dues of unskilled laborers don't go up significantly every year. Someone has to pay for that summer home and your new boat!

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Re: Nooooooo Twinkies

Tell me Kemp, what were the Union's demands?

Brother Simon, Keeper of Ages, Defender of Faith.
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Re: Nooooooo Twinkies

Nobody's talking. tongue

They wanted more pay. The company went bankrupt.

I'm a big fan of freedom, so I'll go ahead and tell you the alternative I'd have chosen over tyranny: The company should have been free to hire whoever they wanted, and everyone who wanted higher pay should have been free to find higher paying work elsewhere, as their educations, skills, intellect, hard work, and productivity allowed.

[I wish I could obey forum rules]

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Re: Nooooooo Twinkies

The company wanted relaxed rules

They had many brands: Hostess, Wonderbread, and more.

Union rules required a seperate driver per brand (aka 1 hostess truck and 1 Wonderbread truck for each store they deliver to).

The company also asked for a 1 year pause on company contributions to pensions

Finally they asked employees to pay a higher share for the extremely expensive insurance benefits the employees wanted.

There were two unions involved: Teamsters and the Bakers Union (longer title cut short).

The Teamsters held a ballot vote and a strong majority voted yes for the agreement (they wanted to keep working).

The Bakers used voice vote and the Union Bosses reported 90% against agreeing. Ofc there is no intimidation in a voice count with angry bullies standing round seeing who says aye and who says nay... much more better than a secret ballot is... (end sarcasm).


The jobs are gone for at least a year if not longer. When returned it is likely they won't be paying even half the same wages or giving even 1/3 the same benefits. So the workers, if their job returns, really screwed themselves.

Everything bad in the economy is now Obama's fault. Every job lost, all the debt, all the lost retirement funds. All Obama. Are you happy now? We all get to blame Obama!
Kemp currently not being responded to until he makes CONCISE posts.
Avogardo and Noir ignored by me for life so people know why I do not respond to them. (Informational)

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Re: Nooooooo Twinkies 

They wanted more pay. The company went bankrupt.

.....they were actually protesting a pay cut.

Brother Simon, Keeper of Ages, Defender of Faith.
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Re: Nooooooo Twinkies

Union leadership showed it wasn't afraid to lose the jobs of tens of thousands of union members if it didn't get what it wanted. Victory overlords! Companies better think twice, union leadership would rather all lose jobs than not squeeze all it can! Thank god our tyrannical government forces businesses to deal with these jackasses. Just imagine a free market where costs of doing business were lower and tens of thousands more had jobs. Oh, the humanity!

[I wish I could obey forum rules]

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65 Reply by V. Kemp (edited by V. Kemp 19-Nov-2012 13:04:00)

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Re: Nooooooo Twinkies

Protesting a pay cut? The 8% cut immediately followed by a more than 8% increase over 5 years?

How would you judge their success? They got a 100% pay cut.

Anyone claiming the union was benevolent and the management was evil is free to compete in the free market. If this company was so mismanaged and treated its workers so poorly, surely their increased costs as a result of waste and their decreased quality/productivity as a result of poor employee treatment are a disadvantage in the market.

I wish I had a low-skilled, low-demand job that offered a pension. These dumbasses gave up a sweet deal because their overlords told them they deserved a sweeter one. Good going. Now they have nothing. Poor babies. I feel so bad for the "bakers" of production-line twinkies who lost their jobs. They're such professionals! They DESERVED more than the free market provided! It's someone else's fault that they weren't actually skilled and nobody else would offer them more compensation for their unskilled labor!

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Re: Nooooooo Twinkies

We tried free market approach to labor before. The general consensus was that it sucked. That is why we introduced labor laws in the first place.

Brother Simon, Keeper of Ages, Defender of Faith.
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Re: Nooooooo Twinkies

No we tried monopolies.

That did not work.

The only labor laws we need are ones preventing monopolies or collusion. That. Is. All. We. Need.

The free market, with those 2 controls, has not really had a chance yet. Not at all.

Everything bad in the economy is now Obama's fault. Every job lost, all the debt, all the lost retirement funds. All Obama. Are you happy now? We all get to blame Obama!
Kemp currently not being responded to until he makes CONCISE posts.
Avogardo and Noir ignored by me for life so people know why I do not respond to them. (Informational)

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Re: Nooooooo Twinkies

I'm assuming a lot of jobs won't be lost but relocated. There's some valuable brands in the portfolio, there's no reason why these can't be sold off to competitors.

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sdffdgjfhjdfhgjhsfsdfqgsbsthzgflqkcgjhkgfjnbkmzghkmqrghqmskdghqkmsghnvhdf
qmkjghqmksdjqlskhqkmsdhqmskfhjqmskjdfhqkmsdfjhqmskfhjqkmsjdfhqkm
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kjnqsdfqsdfqsdfmkjqhgmkjnqsgkjmhzdflmghjsmdlghjsmdkghmqksdjghq

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Re: Nooooooo Twinkies

flint, you've yet to answer post #59.

Brother Simon, Keeper of Ages, Defender of Faith.
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Re: Nooooooo Twinkies

I don't claim that unions never helped anyone avoid horrible conditions and being used, Simon. But long past are the days of the company store. Anyone in such a sparsely populated area as to not have options today should start walking. Problem solved.

As Einstein has pointed out, freedom was never the problem: monopolies (lack of competition/free choice) were.

Why would he have to respond to post 59? What part of "free" don't you get? If they're horribly managed, as you allege, that's a competitive advantage to their competitors. If you are correct, their competitors will create jobs (win for all) and bring down prices (win for all).

The free market handles these things more beautifully and justly than any system controlled by man ever could.

If you're seeking to make a point, could you give it to us more concisely? Did the union benefit its members in this instance? Did the executives of the company break any laws or violate any moral code? Should anything have been done differently?

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Re: Nooooooo Twinkies

Post #58 seemed answered in the following discussions but meh... let's play this game.


Union: we want high pensions, unneccessary jobs, special perks, and pay raises

Company: unnaffordable

Union: Strike!

Company (folds): ok we will try...

Years later...

Company: Declaring bankruptcy

Union: owies, well how about a quarter of our old demands backwards

Investors: that could work *invests*

Year later

Company: Not working
Investors: No good
Union: ok here we agree to a bit more
Investor: fine I'll hold my nose and try
Company: yipee more stringing us out

Year later:
CEO: this is not working, they only give so much. They don't negotiate for our success they negotiate for a no profit status. I quit
Company: oh shit... hey if we give a raise will you stay? It will be hard to hire someone to manage a pending corportate collapse..
CEO: Fine

Months later
Company: This plan will save the company, save your jobs, and all can be happy
Teamsters Union Boss: We don't know we will vote
Teamsters Union: Agreed
Bakers Union Boss: Oh hell no, imma game this (female wolf)... VOICE VOTE
Bakers Union: We agree
Bakers Union Boss: I heard a majority say they disagree
Company: Bankruptcy, you all are fired
Workers: Oh SOB

Everything bad in the economy is now Obama's fault. Every job lost, all the debt, all the lost retirement funds. All Obama. Are you happy now? We all get to blame Obama!
Kemp currently not being responded to until he makes CONCISE posts.
Avogardo and Noir ignored by me for life so people know why I do not respond to them. (Informational)

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Re: Nooooooo Twinkies

hahahaha

Yeah, voice votes are real dignified. Always legit!

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Re: Nooooooo Twinkies

New from Hardee

The core joke of Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy is that of course no civilization would develop personal computers with instant remote database recovery, and then waste this technology to find good drinks.
Steve Jobs has ruined this joke.

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Re: Nooooooo Twinkies

I agree with the delegate from Balsz.

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Re: Nooooooo Twinkies

First up, what hardee's calls cheese is the most vile excuse of a cheese in Christendom. Second, what you got there is a scone. Albeitin a form very unfamiliar to anyone in the Anglosphere except maybe New Zealand.

Third up, there's regional variation to names ... eg a tea cake is different in different parts of America. And different to the UK... which also has regional variation.

Fourth up, your US Biscuits aren't very nice. I had to let them go cold and then add butter and jam to make them edible, made my southerner girlfriend a tad angry.

Fifth if you want to eat gravy, try making Yorkshire puddings. Be assured that is comfort food heaven.

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