26

Re: SD Market

Torqez: "Perhaps the range was too big, or there was too high of a chance that the outer edges of the range could be reached"
Warsie: "To say nothing of the rapid and large swings in price which make the current market function like a broken ATM"
twosidedeath: "the market needs to be slowed down and less critical changes. "
Noir: "In my opinion the randomness is too high, the range of prices and the fact that it can go from top to bottom in no time!"
Render: "I would even say a range of 5-10% of the old price"
Poley: "Either the min/max values change to not allow great disparity (maxing out @ 20-25, food @ .25, mins whatever.) Fix the price to some what how Render has said 2 posts up. Or adjust it a % wise like Noir has posted."

It looks like quite a few of you think the market swings from highs to lows too quickly.

Right now the market has small chance of picking new prices every tick. An alternative to this is to have the market change every tick, but the change would be limited to within a small range of the current prices (-5gc to 5gc). What do you think of that?

Rehabilitated IC developer

Re: SD Market

next round, you cant change it now yikes

~*✠ ]PW[ Forever ✠*~

Re: SD Market

limited change every tick

Re: SD Market

NO market!

"Sticks and stones may break my bones, but i am Jesus"
"Nothing is worse than a fully prepared fool"

30

Re: SD Market

> Ps wrote:

Right now the market has small chance of picking new prices every tick. An alternative to this is to have the market change every tick, but the change would be limited to within a small range of the current prices (-5gc to 5gc). What do you think of that?


I think it would be good for gameplay, and that way nolifers like Spam can never have a chance to survive a round because they dont know how to play SS without being 24/7 waiting for a market event.

I know many market players in this game, and I appreciate the ability tho I don't like it for myself, but this SD round, the benefits from market playing were exagerated, and NO WAY can market decide who wins and who loses a round, it can be a factor to win or lose, but NEVER THE DEFINITIVE.

31

Re: SD Market

btw I re-read the post and still -5gc to +5gc every tic is a big change imo, it could be reasonable to do it every 5 tics like Noir said.
And for food +1gc to -1gc every 5 tics.  I supose this would be good for the server aswell, only make those calcs every 5 hours.

About how you decide it is positive or negative and the amount idk how are you doing it, random? keeping queues of inputs/outputs and then changing according to those queues?  Please Ps give us some more info about this, we can help willingly smile

Re: SD Market

did you mean .01 for food? if food is changing 1gc im all in food for the profitzz

and 5gc for octo, endu even iron isnt really that much, there is a percent chance, and that being the maximum change? sounds reasonable and yes there would still be the ability to make a profit but there would be a much bigger chance to loose money in the attempt to make extra profit

33

Re: SD Market

hmmm .01 every 5 tics is really poor imo, maybe 0.5 is the right number if you think 1 is too much, just notice, the range by doing it +1 to -1 is 2gc, and the range by doing it +0.5 to -0.5 is 1gc, much more reasonible considering for iron/octa/endu the range is 10gc

34

Re: SD Market

oh and just an aditional idea, if we finally agree to change every 5 tics, Ps could implement a countdown in HQ telling how many tics are left to market update.

Re: SD Market

dear god i hope you mean buying food at 2gc because selling food for anything over .5 is a goldmine

Re: SD Market

if there was a countdown it should be on the market page

37 (edited by [Render] 09-Oct-2011 03:10:38)

Re: SD Market

hell no, what Ps means with a range of +5 to -5 is that the price can vary in that range from the previous price, so lets say

buy iron at 7.49 in tic0, same in tic 1,2,3,4, then in tic5 it can go up or down no more than 5 gc

Easy way to do it is random, getting a random number between 0.01 and 5.00 and then adding it or substracting it to the previous price.

The same goes with food but this time the random number is between 0.01 and 0.50

The random mode is easy to implement and relaxed for the server, tho it makes no sense at all, its still usefull.
The logic mode would imply to calculate inputs vs outputs in the 5 previous tics and set a number in that range (-5 to +5) according to the input/output difference. There are many ways to calculate this and it would really work with offers and demands rules, so this has a lot of sense, but it is more complex to do.


Oh and yes the countdown should be in the market page smile

Re: SD Market

Render do you understand farms make 100 food per tick? And selling it at .5 means you would make 50gc per tick off a farm (5 times the average income from a CF). It would need to be a change between .01-.1 every 5 ticks but min/max values still need to be lowered because ppl could still hoard millions of res and risk the price change till it gets higher smile

"I lie down next to an angel, fall asleep and fly with the demons"
I once prayed to god for some planets, but quickly found out he didnt work that way

39 (edited by [Render] 09-Oct-2011 11:55:47)

Re: SD Market

yes but its still a risky operation considering it can go down -0.5 meaning you would make -50gc per tic wink

anyway, that's the extreme value, you have 1/50 chances it goes that way

but its ok, I agree between 0.01 and 0.10 is an even slighter change, and thats what we lookin for, ok for the random mode, but not ok for the logic mode because we're moving on a range of only 10 steps, when people sells 10 millions food in the previous 5 tics then you reduce price the max value thats -0.1, the reduction should be bigger imo hmm you need a longer range to make it fit with logic market movements.

40 (edited by Noir 09-Oct-2011 11:58:21)

Re: SD Market

PS just for the record this is why you want me on the development team wink

LORD HELP OREGON

Re: SD Market

if any change happens pls inform players at least 48 hours before.

Re: SD Market

maybe cap the market. in a way that there is only (for example) 200,000,000 food on the market, until the prices change again and then there is a similar amount, if it runs out, it runs out, and if it runs out, then the price next time goes up, if it doesn't run out, the price can go down? it will stop people buying billions of food if there is only a certain amount on there.

Re: SD Market

it will have to be changed in a better way than that imo, but it shouldnt be hard

LORD HELP OREGON

44 (edited by Paininside 17-Oct-2011 19:41:55)

Re: SD Market

but then u gotta come up with a base price to start from.
make sure 1 iron/end/food/cf infra create just as much gc, so

8gc for a CF + 50% inc bonus
so 12gc start price

then bor wil be fair (keep it like this for 72hours to let everyone able to grow properly without advantidge from the market) then have the random 5% up or down each tick, resulting in stil variable change and then people can decide to take the profit, or risk more to get bigger profit.

Colorado: even in the 11/01 war i made more hits.
Colorado: 447 blow jobs.
Big Gary:  Only a fool cannot admit when he's wrong...
AW:    i love rim jobs
RisingDown: I know you do

Re: SD Market

i think endu should start at 50 gc and gradually move towards the meduim, iron shoudl start around 25gc as resources take longer to come in and its often endu that we run out of. otherwise it is easy to buy endu and keep building

Re: SD Market

Well its getting good guys!!

gold 11,529,968,142,906

LORD HELP OREGON

Re: SD Market

Doesn't anyone in this galaxy use Destroy Cash anymore?  Jeez!  tongue

Make Eyes Great Again!

The Great Eye is watching you... when there's nothing good on TV...

Re: SD Market

> Noir wrote:

> Well its getting good guys!!

> gold 11,529,968,142,906



An example of a broken setup...

"Sticks and stones may break my bones, but i am Jesus"
"Nothing is worse than a fully prepared fool"

Re: SD Market

if u would make endu 50gc then u force people to build refs, even the cash bankers cuz then it wouldnt pay off to build CF's
so if u want a fair equal start, u should not make prices so high. stick to same gc a cash banker earns from 1 infra, then either people can go resource or go CF start, but grow equally for the first x ticks. (not taking building time in this calculation, but u could make resources a little bit more worth to even out the cash loss for the first x ticks, but also this u gotta calculate properly and ud need to know how manny ticks market wil be unchanged.

either keep it fair for all races, or just drop the market, u want diversity in the races even for a hc gall. more fun ud say.

Colorado: even in the 11/01 war i made more hits.
Colorado: 447 blow jobs.
Big Gary:  Only a fool cannot admit when he's wrong...
AW:    i love rim jobs
RisingDown: I know you do

Re: SD Market

You can have the buy prices set at whatever (20+ would be the min). Its the sell prices you want some what to resemble equality in production. That would require a fixed market with no chance of change.

SS should force ppl to build a lil of everything and only purchase on market something in dire need.

"I lie down next to an angel, fall asleep and fly with the demons"
I once prayed to god for some planets, but quickly found out he didnt work that way