> paul valter pihlo wrote:
> @fokker
"> besides 8mx6m is almost as large as my livingroom so I wouldn't complain:)<
That had better be a very bad joke."
yes, it was...
I know it's 8ftx6ft<

I like how people accepted your suggestion that a British prison cell is 8 meters X 6 meters unquestioningly!
Oh, and sorry... it's this heat, it causes my brain to bypass my humour gland.

>"that's true in combat. but once you've captured the enemy thay should get a fair trial of somesort or find out what kind of person the enemy is, not executed on sight.(besides my grampa was fighting the russkies).<"
"Under ideal circumstances, yes"
"How many Luftwaffe pilots shot down during the Blitz got a trial before being locked up?"
"They were obviously guilty"
so you agree POWs(under ideal circumstances) should get a fair trial, except luftwaffe pilots who are automaticaly guilty...<

Now you're trying to muddle two very seperate points methinks, although I can see that it could be unintentional.
You have to understand that my comment regarding the WW2 pilots was a reflection of the attitudes at the time: They are Nazis and therefore guilty, but to keep everyone happy we'll try them after the war is done.

>hmm.... makes me think.<

Try thinking about it from another perspective... if you can put your personal feeling aside?

>"but here in the UK we don't have the facilities to keep prisoners indefinitley just because the war might end soon"
I think the yell already answered that by keeping prisoners in camps in war zones, not inside the country...<

Right, and we were going to do that how? Ask Hitler ever so nicely if we can keep all of the soldiers we've captured in occupied France?

>although that way it'll be easier for the enemy to liberate their prisoners.... unless your confident in victory.<

Which is exactly why we didn't do that.

> Einstein wrote:
> There is a section of Oregon still suffering extremely under our snow packs.
Now for the worst timed headline in the world!
http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/nationworld/2004157490_warmwater01.html
Note they had doomsday predictions for the snowpack?
http://www.oregonlive.com/news/oregonian/index.ssf?/base/news/1201935308295190.xml&coll=7
http://www.nbc10.com/news/15214786/detail.html
http://www.jacksonholestartrib.com/articles/2008/02/04/news/regional/d07cd7093020a776872573e20060af5d.txt
http://www.upi.com/Top_News/2008/02/04/State_uses_helicopter_to_cause_avalanches/UPI-24971202159585/
Start looking at our snow pack
http://www.nohrsc.nws.gov/interactive/html/map.html?mode=pan&zoom=&center_x=+-123.81&center_y=+++44.78&ql=station&var=ssm_depth&dy=2008&dm=2&dd=5&dh=23&snap=1&o9=1&o12=1&o13=1&lbl=m&min_x=-123.99208333332&min_y=41.171667353307&max_x=-116.48374999999&max_y=46.80500068664&coord_x=-120.237916666655&coord_y=43.9883340199735&zbox_n=&zbox_s=&zbox_e=&zbox_w=&metric=0&bgvar=dem&width=600&height=450&nw=600&nh=450&type=0&js=1&uc=0
Yeah it was that big<

I see you're still clinging desperately to the misnomer of Global Warming, which your argument depends on for survival. If we lefties have the spine/brains to admit it is a misnomer and that we should have called it Climate Change from the beginning, why cant you have the spine/brains to accept that?
In spite of your faults I thought you were smarter than this... I hate being wrong.

>Now then, to talk about this subject we can see that real science is ignored for 'modeling' science.

Cosmic Radiation has been shown, been PROVEN to produce clouds and to be the source of moisture condensing into clouds, and he dismisses it out of hand. Seems to me that clouds produce an effect where they bounce heat back out of our atmosphere...<

If you're going to keep dragging this tired old argument out could you have the sense to wait untill everyone has forgotten about how it got flattened by a real scientist on this very forum?
But still:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/3419975.stm

"The Eos authors, led by Stefan Rahmstorf from the Potsdam Institute for Climate Impact Research, Germany, say the paper by Shaviv and Veizer was "incorrect and based on questionable methodology".
They say the data on cosmic rays and temperature so far in the past are extremely uncertain.
They argue that the authors' reconstruction of ancient cosmic rays is based on only 50 meteorites, and say most other experts interpret their significance in a very different way.
Arguing that Shaviv and Veizer had in places adjusted the data, "in one case by 40 million years", the Eos team says they did not show any correlation between cosmic rays and climate.
And even if their analysis had been methodologically correct, it says, their work applied to time scales of several million years, while the current climate warming has occurred during just a hundred years, for which completely different mechanisms are relevant.
Dr Shaviv told BBC News Online: "The article in Eos raises general claims without substantiating them with any actual evidence. The few more specific arguments that they bring are simply flawed and easily refuted.""

>Lets talk weather for real however.
Ever hear of the Dustbowl?<

You mean the time when American farmers over farming activities reduced a great swathe of your country to Sub-Saharan conditions? Let me guess; That was cosmic rays too? I suppose it's possible, IF your own Government's reports are leftist lies, which is unlikely as back then you Americans developed nervous tics at the mere sight of the colour red.

>What sort of flooding occured to shove Italians up to higher ground, and most med sea persons as well? In historic times that is.<

How historic? Too historic to be relevant?

>Now how bout glaciers?
Click the link here to see the list of growing and NEW glaciers
http://www.iceagenow.com/List_of_Expanding_Glaciers.htm<

You, and whatever idiot wrote that article, clearly have no idea how glaciers work, as well as insiting on working under the misnomer Global Warming.

>Contrary to popular belief in climatic stability during recent times, the Earth's
climate of the past 1000 years has changed significantly.

The Medieval climatic optimum (AD 700-1200) was a time of extremely
favorable climate in northern Europe. Harvests were good, fishing was abundant,
sea ice remained far to the north, vineyards flourished 300 miles north of their
present limits, and famine was rare. This was the period of great Viking expansion
from Scandinavia. Viking settlements were based on cereal grains (wheat and
barley) and dairy herds (goats, sheep, and cattle).

Iceland began settling in AD 874 and soon became an independent republic.
Greenland was colonized in AD 985 by Erik the Red. By the 12th century,
two sizeable communities existed in southwestern Greenland.

During the Medieval climatic optimum, sea level stood at least a half meter
higher in southern Florida than today from the first through tenth centuries.

        In other words, sea levels in the Atlantic have fallen at least
        19 inches in the last 1,000 years.

Climatic deterioration began in the 1200s; glaciers expanded in Iceland and in
the Alps. Vineyards began declining in Germany and by the 1300s had completely
disappeared in England. Fishing replaced cereal grains as the main source of food
in Iceland, and sea ice expanded southward between Greenland and Iceland.
Around 1340-50 the more northerly of the two Greenland communities was
abandoned to the Inuits. By 1510, only Inuits remained. Cold climate reduced
dairy production, and extensive sea ice hampered essential trade with Europe.

Across the Pacific Islands, during the period AD 1270-1475, sea level fell
by more than a meter and temperatures declined an average 1

Not that it is relevant to the topic (hell, the entire thread is now careening off-topic)

"Ummm, the United States lacks NO NATURAL RESOURCE. I think we might run low on coffee if hard pressed with -NO- trade, but to be frank... Europe would sink faster than we would."

You have forgotten about Europe's newest members: The Eastern Bloc. If you don't remember them; they were the countries that essentially fed the USSR. The Ukraine was actually known as "Russia's Breadbasket" for decades, and now they're ours, along with their buddies.
They make some [shite]-hot food, their tea is actually superior to most Indian varieties, they churn out so many varieties of bread even the Germans don't know what to do with it all, and the chocolate... mmm... shame about the unpronouncable names, but I'm sure all it takes is practice.

21:06:79

_Meteor shower! Very spectacular, and in broad daylight too. We're waiting for it to clear so we can take off; most of the crew are watching. If Danni were here she'd bore me stupid with
Danni

_What the hell is wrong with me? It took me seven days to realise my best freind was dead! Seven bloody days! And not just her, a whole damn liner full of people, hundreds of people, and here I am giggling and flirting like I'm on a summer holiday... Seriously, what the hell?
Maybe I should just space myself, I feel like spacing myself, I really do.

_We're going to Beta 12 now. Ther's been some trouble getting through to the rescue people, it's almost like subspace itself is nerfed, but I don't think that is the problem: This ship is O L D.
I keep thinking about Danni, and the liner, and all of those people.
I have decided to be depressed for a while.

> Black_Wing wrote:
> Chechnyians ??  ROFL.
Thats up to you in Europe to take care of.  As long as it is not you, in your country.....its ok.
You really want to go down that road......idiot ??<

Nice spin attempt, shame it doesn't distract; and as for getting tetchy over me making a comment in the same manner as the post it was in response to, well, that speaks for itself.

>It took the US military to stop the Serbs from slaughtering non-serbs for another uncontested 18 months while you all in Europe turned a righteous and non-committal to violence blind eye.<

This is relevant to the discussion about the future of the UK-US relationship how?

>You pacifist types in the UK can also join the ranks of the US Leftists as well.   Because, there is hardly a "We the People" Consensus to fight the bastards who wish to kill you and your mothers in the US.<

What a mature statement, now I am utterly confounded as to why people address you in the disrespective manner that they do.

>As to the rest of your post FOKKER ??....... nonsense of course.<

Say what you like, everyone who counts knows better.

> A band of thugs called Sinn Fein wanted to kill Brits.
A global assembly of like-minded Nazis wish to kill anyone that is not of their faith.<

Actually Sinn Fein tortured and killed Protestants, Protestant Sympathizers, Catholics who were mature enough to put aside idiotic differences and assosciate with Protestants, and even have the gall to marry Protestants.

>No, terrorism and thuggery are NOT the same.<

I know, I've spent 20 of my 29 years living under the very real threat of terrorism.

> paul valter pihlo wrote:

> how long were you in prison couple months or years.<

Years.

>he lived under stalin, thats worse than an english prison believe me.<

Try being alone in an 8x6 for 22 hours a day for a few years. Given the choice, I'd have taken Stalin. Hell, I'd have taken Australia (if they still did that I mean).

>And ,probably, getting sent into prison was your own fault.<

Well DUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUH!

>lately you've been writing really good posts and making the most sense in this forum but you're view of looking at the common soldier in a dictatorship, and assuming he's automaticaly guilty of war crimes is just wrong.<

Not wrong, realistic: The enemy is the enemy. It's not nice, it's not fair, but when you are at war with someone you don't play nice just because they might have a sad story to tell...

> DPS wrote:

> Fokker when you said "illegal war" were you actually talking about Afghanistan, as people keep bringing up, or Iraq, as would seem to fit the descriptor better.

I'm pretty sure going to Afghanistan was legal, justified, and expected.<

Give that man a Banana! *claps*

>As for why a US/UK relationship is important well they've got to have at least one country in every continent that doesn't hate them.<

A tactical friendship?

>"Only an idiot ties to win an election by campaigning in another country"

Unless he's trying to appear worldly.  America's Global reputation has taken a few hits under Bush, to some people this is quite important, and Obama appearing to try and repair the damage can win these people over.  Also it shows he is capable of holding a conversation with a HoS elevating himself into that peer group.<

Ah... didn't think of that. Good point.

Just like I should be able to walk around HAARLEM wearing a sign that says I HATE N_____S without worry of repercussions.

Man I love DIE HARD

> TheYell wrote:

> Cause I was a medieval history major and time and time again I'd read "Country X's economy went in the toilet during the famous Little Ice Age of the blath century"  Such swings happen naturally and repeatedly.<

What is this in response to (not that I actually asked a question) and how is it relevant?

>Yes good luck with global trade without a NATO navy to protect it.  And don't think we'll keep ours up to date with what's coming.<

Again, what is this in response to and how is this relevant?

> Black_Wing wrote:

> What is really funny is the Taliban, who ruled Afghanistan kept up the supply of Tar Heroin.
What the Euros and the UN believed was the numbers the TALIBAN told them was the Heroin crop.   Of course that was false.<

Yup. And even after that display of utter stupidity the EU still wonders why the UK won't fully join.

>Why is that ??  Because the source of Taliban funding now, is STILL the Heroin crop.
So much for "Religious" righteousness.<

I always get a little giggle out of that one too

>As to the US, UK alliance.......  the US, UK and Canada, Aussie will ALWAYS be in together when one or the other is attacked.<

Aye, for better or worse. Stupid language.

>When the UK sent a fleet to Argentina, the US turned the other way.  Even though, we always vowed protection from aggression from any powers that intruded on South and Central America.<

Are you talking about the Falklands? The islands we have ruled, uncontested, for 150 years? The islands the Argies keep wanting to take "back" by force because there's a zonking huge oil reserve under there? Yeah, that was aggression.

>Yea....the World Wars.....Even w/o a UK alliance, it was given that the US would be in to fight not only w/the UK in WW1 but vs. tyranny and military aggression in WW2.<

I don't want to sound ungreatful, but in WW2 you sat on your hands untill you were attacked. I think originally the plan was to sit it out and shake hands with the winner.

>In this fight on Terror.....to equate Sinn Fein w/Al Qaeda is just stupid.  One was political the other is Religious.  One was very isolated, the other global. <

Terrorism is terrorism.

>YOU in the UK were attacked by Al Qaeda.  You had home grown Islamists attack your subway system.<

Before or after our glorious government publicly pledged allegiance to you AGAINST the will of the people?

>The Spanish were attacked, and decided to go hide in a cave with the Shoe Maker, French style.<

Like I give a crap about Spain.

>The US was attacked first, in a grand style, but it was a target that killed scores of people that were citizens of other countries as well.<

And memebers of other faiths too, like Islam.

>The UK, rightfully so, joined the US to eradicate not only the Taliban, and the Al Qaeda home country, but to eradicate the number one funder of terrorist organizations as a nation state.<

You're beginning to miss the point: We the people didn't want to join. Doesn't that irk your neo-con sense of freedom even a bit? You might not like it, and I understand why, but can you understand the level of wrongness that was involved in that decision, the decision to ignore the will of the people for the sake of good PR in a country that looks down on us anyway? (that's what it feels like)

>AND....to set an example to those that are also nation state terror funders.   Pakistan...some what, Saudi Arabia and Lybia have all changed their ways.<

Wasn't Saudi Arabia already changing anyway, for economic reasons?

>If YOU are wanting to hide in a cave,......move to SPAIN and surrender like they did.<

If YOU are wanting to force countries to run by your rules do it properly and move to Russia and kill Chechnyans.
See, I can play the idiot game too.

>As to OBAMA......   he is a tool.
the Bastard will be back in his Chicago slum, robbing the poor blacks of their Dignity in the next six months.
Thats if the Rev. Wright doesnt have him eliminated in the near future.<

No argument here. Only an idiot ties to win an election by campaigning in another country whilst having photos taken with leader who everyone knows will be outed by Christmas.
__________

Bono can go spin too

They were released when they reached 18 rather than being held for the rest of their lives because of the abuse question: Where exactly does a 10 year old get those ideas from? They certainly don't form naturally.

Let me tell you something from personal experience: Abused children act out. You think I'm a knob now, you should have met me when I was fostered.

> TheYell wrote:

> Like I said, no science.  Your likes and desires are about as meaningful, scientifically, as the sincere faith of an Orsini cardinal reading Galileo's pamphlet.<

No you're right: No science, just common zarquon sense.
__________

> Deci wrote:

> fokker, he still has no incentive to change his behaviour. it's your kid, not his. i even throw the recyclable bottles in the garbage because i can't be bothered to take them to the store. not caring is a bliss.<

That's what I like about you, you're a dick sometimes but at least you're honest.