"Dr. Evil

"Moral anti-realism does not mean "pillage, rape, murder." All that's required is to believe that our moral convictions are extraneous from the facts. For example, John Locke correctly understood human behavior as, for example, generally cooperative. His error was concluding that those facts about human behavior proved there was a natural moral law. In fact, he only supported a hypothesis about human behavior, not morality."

There is no difference between arguing human beings flock to form common ideas of society, and, arguing the existence of a natural moral law.  It is like saying "There is no gravity, there is just a propensity of masses to drift towards each other"

"Finally, your belief that America was founded as a Theocracy, or that the constitution forbids Theocracy, is bizarre and contrary to the historical facts."

No. The Libertarian argument that the traditional laws of the United States and its various States and local communities in fact rise to the level of the dreaded Theocracy, banned by the 1st Amendment and later the 14th -- only, nobody was smart enough to figure this out until the 1970s... THAT is bizarre and contrary to historical facts.

more likely they would steal it and use it on theri own game

"You Social Conservatives want to use the law enforcement apparatus to compel people to worship your god and only copulate within the context of a heterosexual marriage etc. Libertarians think writing laws to serve such interests is an abuse of power, and would like to see government's intervention in people's lives greatly reduced. Why is this so hard for you to understand?"

Oh I "get it", I know very well what we're out to destroy.  Why is that so hard for you to get, that we understand your POV and don't give a rat's ass?

oh wait, its part of that dangerous naivete

The use of government force against the Klan is well documented, and so, no, you don't get to come back after force was used and say "Oh but it's repressed by peaceful means" any more than you could pretend the Brits don't run the US because of our good relations with the UK.

Ahhhhhh so you bold libertarians oppose murder, kidnapping, torture etc, you just demand the right of people to join Hooded Murder Torturers Klub! Hurray

"In the case of the KKK, it's easily understood they were confused about "evil" and employed terrorism to get their way. So they really aren't a relevant example.
Last edited by Justinian I (Yesterday 14:57:37)"

Not in the 1920s.  After the first generation of Klansmen who joined to basically keep fighting the Civil War, it became a White Anglo-Saxon Protestant special interest group and militia.  Mayors and Governors ran as Klansmen.  They paraded in the streets of DC in the 1920s wearing their hoods.  They helped keep Al Smith, a Catholic, out of the White House and their help was welcomed.   

And again, while people were certainly compelled to offer support for the Klan, no question, nobody HAD to join.

That you think this massive political movement is no relevant example, just shows you don't understand how freedom works.  People need to believe they are living within the rules.  It is not a question of whether we have rules -- you can't stop people from imposing them on themselves.  I It's a question of what rules we enforce.  There's no point being ashamed of it.

The idea that anybody could see the Klan was cruel and evil, is bogus.  Plenty didn't.  That point of view had to be imposed on the country by outlawing the Klan and breaking it up with the force of law.

Libertarian "ideals" are about enjoyment of restraint on the part of others that you have no right to demand, nor any capability to enforce

it is "defended against" by telling you to enjoy sobriety and achieve exactly the same outcome as that personal pleasure you cite as the justification for libertarianism

The Vigilance Committee, the Ku Klux Klan, Wild Bill Hickock hired to beat up outsider yahoos, that's the American consequence of unbridled liberty. The professionalisms of the state are merely organized expressions of what the common man would do to himself if there were no Law.

Yeah I said the KKK, a volunteer collection of like-minded Americans repressing what they considered social evil that was destroyed and repressed by a volunteer collection of like-minded Americans out to conquer social evil by force.

australia

all you had to do was pretend to be a think tank for Mitt Romney so we got paid....

this is the biggest foulup since the Commission blew the HUD windows contract for the 5 bouroughs

free coffee is a goodness